Michael J. Totten: How Beautiful the Middle East...Could Be

May 20, 2006

How Beautiful the Middle East...Could Be

"Something there is that doesn't love a wall, that wants it down" - Robert Frost

Lebanese blogger Perpetual Refugee wrote the following in Israeli
blogger Lisa Goldman's comments section.

I can image the drive up to Beirut from Tel Aviv. You'd of course take the scenic route. The Mediterranean always on your left hand side. I would assume you'd leave in the morning, the sun already having risen in the east. It would be sunny. It usually is. As you drive north past Haifa, the terrain starts to roll. The hills become mountains. Acre. Nahariyya. Then the border. The Lebanese customs officer smiles and being Lebanese, starts to chat you up. He'll impress you with a 'Bokaltov' followed by 'Bienvenue a Liban'. You enter without any problems. Your Israeli passport stamped. Your license plates remain as they are. And you drive. The signs are now in Arabic and French. You already feel the difference, and yet, you're comfortable. It still feels good, comfortable. You get excited as you pass the ancient city of Tyre. You feel the urge to stop and see what Alexander the Great found so fascinating about the city. But you don't. You'll be back. Further north, you reach Saida (Sidon). It's stunning, a bit more Islamic in feel. Again, you want to stop but not today. Today you have a date with Beirut. And you'll fall in love.

Perpetual Refugee is in Israel now even though his government absolutely forbids him to go there. This should be required reading. Especially if you're Lebanese.

Posted by Michael J. Totten at May 20, 2006 10:51 PM

Comments

" "

translation: I'm speechless

Posted by: The Perpetual Refugee at May 21, 2006 03:23 AM

Sigh...
I wish to able to make this trip in my lifetime. Both Israel and Lebanon made a big impression on me. There is something incredibly fascinating to both countries. It's high on my wishlist to return to both and of course the best way would be to do that in one and the same trip and in the company of my Lebanese partner (who, by the way, would grab the first chance to visit Israel. It's high on his wishlist)...

Posted by: Myrthe at May 21, 2006 03:42 AM

Someday this will be possible...

Michael, I read your article from LA weekly about visiting Hizbollah...I found it amusing on a number of levels...I would like to point out some things about your writing style that may have offended the Hizbollah PR person who befriended you. You have this "yeah, right" attitude in your observations. It can come across as dismissive or even contemptuous. I think that's what he was reacting to. Also, in my experience with Arab people, I have noticed that saying things one doesn't really mean is common. So actually I believe him when he said he didn't mean to actually threaten you and was just "stressed." I know that sounds funny to an American, but I think he was reacting out of anger because he felt betrayed by the fact that you seemed respectful in person but have a writing style that comes across as contemptuous at times.

Posted by: Elizabeth at May 21, 2006 06:25 AM

Elizabeth reminds us why we like MJT more than the MSM.

Elizabeth, do you criticize terrorists and terror-supporting blogs, or just good people? Just give us some links, please.

Posted by: Joao at May 21, 2006 07:39 AM

“Also, in my experience with Arab people, I have noticed that saying things one doesn't really mean is common.”

And who’s problem is this? I’m sorry but I have little sympathy for a cultural milieu where speaking accurately is so little valued. One has no moral obligation to cut them slack. These folks need to get their act together.

Posted by: David Thomson at May 21, 2006 11:47 AM

Elizabeth, if MJT was respectful in person but contemptuous in his writing, that would have meant he was saying things he didn't really mean. Why would Hizbollah have felt betrayed by someone exhibiting a behavior that is common among Arabs?

Posted by: bgates at May 21, 2006 01:00 PM

MJT, what gives you the right to dictate what should be required reading for Lebanese?

Posted by: Solomon2 at May 21, 2006 01:38 PM

Solomon2: anybody can have an opinion, MJT no less than others. After all, this is his blog.

Posted by: Simon Hawkin at May 21, 2006 01:47 PM

Solomon2,

Isn't dictate a bit much?

Anyway, the reason I think Lebanese need to know more about Israel is because they know almost nothing at all about Israel except anti-Zionist Entity boilerplate. It keeps a pointless cold war humming along. It's harder to hate people when you know them, which is why saying hello to an Israeli on the border is treason. That shit needs to stop.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 21, 2006 02:45 PM

Michael,

How dare you imperialist Americans tell Lebanese which blogs to read? First, you steal Iraq's oil. Then, you blame Syria for an assassination that was actually Israel's fault. Now, you're trying to exert mind control over us through multiple vectors: 1) your "yeah, right" attitude through which we feel your condescending attitude and then feel we must please the imperial master or else feel his wrathe; 2) you outright dictate to us what we are and are not to read.

This blog is a regular Campus Watch. You put Joe McCarthy to shame. He seems like a regular on "Mr. Roger's Neighborhood" compared to you.

Your continual citation of Israeli propaganda only further illuminates your lack of understanding of the Middle East.

You know nothing about the Middle East. You can't distinguish between truth and Israeli propaganda. You're basically the MSM-lite. You don't even make an effort to factcheck the propaganda you are spoon fed.

No wonder you're making millions of dollars off of hardworking people's back.

If only you were more like upstanding, truth speaking, brave men of courage and honor like Juan Cole, Michael Moore, and Noam Chomsky.

Posted by: lebanon.profile at May 21, 2006 03:04 PM

Okay, I just had to write that to get all of the stupid arguments out of the way and return to the subject at hand:

THE PERPETUAL REFUGEE

HIS BLOG

and

LEBANESE-ISRAELI RELATIONS

!!!!!!

Come on, people. Let's keep the comments germane.

Posted by: lebanon.profile at May 21, 2006 03:08 PM

Lebanon.Profile,

My mind control ray worked amazingly well on you. Just look at yourself showing flickerings of sympathy for the Zionist Entity. Muahahaha! (I do earn my money.)

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 21, 2006 03:12 PM

It's time for the war to end.

It's time that people like the Perpetual Refugee and Lisa Goldman can physically be in the same place.

They speak the same language, share the same values, have a similar relationship to the West, blog, and love wine. The main differences are religion and nationality.

It's a crime to keep us separated for political reasons.

The most powerful scene in the film "Paradise Now" is when the bomber chooses not to blow himself up while looking at an innocent child. Even he realizes that the child has nothing to do with the cause he is fighting for.

Palestinians claim their battle is over land rights. Take it to court, the papers, and international consensus.

Posted by: lebanon.profile at May 21, 2006 03:15 PM

LP, they could probably take it to Israel itself at this point. I'm not an expert, but the recent elections and removal of some settlements seem like an indication that it is possible to try and reach some sort of agreement.

Posted by: mike at May 21, 2006 06:14 PM

Lebanon.Profile,

that was fun.

Palestinians claim their battle is over land rights. Take it to court, the papers, and international consensus.

The Palestinian law societies have boycotted Israeli courts from the beginning.

See, going to an Israeli court would be recognizing the right of Israel to exist.

It's been a war over the right of Israel to exist from the first... And you can't sue to create a genocide.

Posted by: Josh Scholar at May 21, 2006 08:02 PM

LP: Palestinians claim their battle is over land rights. Take it to court, the papers, and international consensus.

The government (Hamas) says it's about "liberating" Tel Aviv and Haifa as well as Jerusalem, Nablus, and Ramallah. They are completely uninterested in courts, the papers, and the international concensus that insists on a two-state solution.

Polls say that's not true of the average Palestinian (anymore). But it is true of their government.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 21, 2006 08:25 PM

Was "dictate" was a bit much? Does it not seem condescending for someone of one nationality to tell someone from another nationality what he or she must do?

It was a hostile question only in this sense: I wanted to prompt you to tell us, explictly, what moral decisions you made for yourself that you wish to impose upon (more kindly, share with) others. And you did precisely that. Thank you very much.

Posted by: Solomon2 at May 21, 2006 09:00 PM

Why not support a campaign to make "Western aid" to the Hamas PA based on them having a referendum to their own people:

1) Do you accept that there be two states: Israel and Palestine?
Yes
No

No borders, no compensation, no right of return. Only right of existence -- so that Hamas can sign a peace agreement without losing face. As said (prior thread?), only Islamists can give Israel peace. A referendum would allow them to do so, AND maintain their turn in gov't, without "betraying their own ideals."

Was there any talk of anything like this?
Michael, what do you think about this as a possibility?

(And only AFTER Palestine is created, or AFTER Iran becomes a free religion respecting democracy, will Hizbollah in Lebanon change.)

Posted by: Tom Grey - Libertay Dad at May 22, 2006 02:07 AM

Tom,

Mahmoud Abbas just floated the idea of a referendum. He wants a referendum on the whole thing, though, not just whether there should be two states or not.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 22, 2006 02:23 AM

Michael, I think these comments speak for themselves. If a simple meeting of a Lebanese (not Palestinian) man and an Israeli woman over a bottle of wine in Tel Aviv is this controversial, imagine anything bigger.

People, listen up. Lebanon is not Palestine. Lebanon is not occupied Palestine. Lebanon is not Syria. Hizbullah is not Hamas. Lebanon is Lebanon. We don't want your wars. We have enough problems on our own.

Posted by: The Perpetual Refugee at May 22, 2006 06:04 AM

Thanks Michael, the full text includes anger and disagreement against unilateralism -- but I'm pretty sure it's the Israel Wall which will also help push Hamas to recognize Israel.

But what's possible for the Israelis, after 1967 & 1973, seems like keeping the Golan Heights and most of what's on their side of the wall. I think they were greedy; but its somewhat understandable -- what Egypt & Jordan did to the Palestinians 48-67 is much worse; and I guess it's bad for them in Lebanon still.

Abbas talks about "justice" -- but there are no "just" solutions. Only some kind of balance of relatively equal "injustice." And, while much of the creation of Israel wasn't necessarily unjust, enough of it was to support injustice claims. Since 1973, most of the agressive injustices seem more from the Palestinian side -- though settlements are a big provocation.

Hey, guess what, Perpetual Refugee -- the USA also doesn't want the Old World's wars, but "you can't always get what you want."

I wish for peace in Lebanon, Israel, Palestine, Iraq, Syria, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Cyprus -- in fact the whole ME and the whole world. I think we'll see a world at peace when we have a world without dictators.

Posted by: Tom Grey - Libertay Dad at May 22, 2006 08:45 AM

Perpetual Refugee is in Israel now even though his government absolutely forbids him to go there.

And that just about sums things up, doesn't it? It's not a "both sides" issue; it's a one side issue and anything which obscures or glosses over that fact facilitates a lie.

Any peace in the Mideast (and I strongly doubt anyone living will see that day) will be due to the surrounding Arab countries ceasing their aggression.

Posted by: Seymour Paine at May 22, 2006 12:27 PM

Perpetual Refugee sums it up very well by pointing out how something that should be fairly simple has escalated. Hopefully tomorrow will bring a better day.

Posted by: buildings r my life at May 22, 2006 01:44 PM

QUEEN ELIZABETH FROM HER UNBIASED THRONE -

bequeathing edited unbiased knowledge to the otherwise misled and mis-informed

Michael, I read your article from LA weekly about visiting Hizbollah...I found it amusing on a number of levels...I would like to point out some things about your writing style that may have offended the Hizbollah PR person who befriended you.

The breadth of this chick's knowledge is well breathtaking.

You have this "yeah, right" attitude in your observations. It can come across as dismissive or even contemptuous. I think that's what he was reacting to.

Imparting knowledge to an otherwise uneducated, unexperienced and misinformed blogger/journalist..... like mannah from heaven

Also, in my experience with Arab people, I have noticed that saying things one doesn't really mean is common. So actually I believe him when he said he didn't mean to actually threaten you and was just "stressed."

Lizzy educating the regular folks.
I myself am now convinced that he was an otherwise intelligent open minded fellow who Michael simply insulted.

So would it be ok for me to threaten to cut Robert Fisk or Norm Finkelstein's head off? I mean you don't get more offensive than those guys? Eh Lizzy?

And after all Michael J Totten is just your typical ignorant American.

I know that sounds funny to an American

Like mannah from heaven baby, impartin knowledge to an otherwise ignorant unexperienced A MER I CAN.

but I think he was reacting out of anger because he felt betrayed by the fact that you seemed respectful in person but have a writing style that comes across as contemptuous at times.

This chick and her little voices are incredibly perceptive. She really has "them Arabs" and their "intentions" down.... Posted by: Mike Nargizian at May 22, 2006 04:29 PM

Lebanon Profile and Michael:

I asked this on one of the other threads, but please explain: what do you mean when you say there is no room for Arabs in the pan-Arab agenda?

Oh, yeah, Elizabeth: I sympathize, I really, really do. I mean, the chutzpah of that stupid Yank, to dare to have like, you know, a personal opinion about something, and then, on top of that, to have the effrontery, the absolute unmitigated gall, to post it on his own personal blog where other people might read it!.

The idea! I mean, jeez, what is the world coming to?

And you know why Hizb'allah might be pissed at Mike?

Hello? They're terrorists! They don't want anybody to know what they're really like.

Posted by: Ephraim at May 22, 2006 06:11 PM

Mr. Seymour Paine,
What about Israeli aggression towards the Palestinians, or is state terrorism acceptable because it is men in uniforms doing the killing?

Last summer while hanging out at the La Gueva Beach resort about 20 minutes south of Beirut, a few friends and I wondered how it would be like if the next day we could all just pile up in a car and drive all the way down to Haifa and spend the weekend there. It seemed as if it would be fun, and we wished that things were different and that one day at least our children might have the chance to do just that.

However, I would not be willing to do so at the expense of the rights of the Palestinian people. For all the Arab countries to make peace with Israel, although I am for that, before the Palestinians make their peace with them would be to leave the Palestinians at the mercy of Israel.

So folks, although it would be great if such things as written by Perpetual Refugee could occur, to blame the Arabs and say that Lebanese should read such accounts, as if it is our fault completely at the way things are, is ridiculous. The Israelis must clean up their act as much as the Arabs need to.

Posted by: Omega80 at May 22, 2006 06:39 PM

Omega,

Of course it is not only the fault of the Lebanese that things are the way they are. No one in the Middle East is innocent. It's a rough neighborhood.

I'm sure there will be no peace between Israel and Lebanon before the Palestinians have their own state. There probably will be no peace between Israel and Lebanon with the current regimes in power in Syria and Iran either.

That said, turning down the temperature in the meantime would not be a bad idea.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 22, 2006 06:45 PM

to blame the Arabs and say that Lebanese should read such accounts, as if it is our fault completely at the way things are, is ridiculous. The Israelis must clean up their act as much as the Arabs need to.

Omega80, to automatically assume that each party in any conflict is equally guilty is utterly simplistic, n'est-ce pas? The French with their top-down Cartesian logic assert this is so but that serves only to keep otherwise-intelligent minds occupied. As the rest of us must live with the consequences of this sort of unreal thinking, would we not do well to reject this sort of wilful blindness?

Posted by: Solomon2 at May 22, 2006 09:02 PM

Omega80:

Perhaps we can all just forget history and get on with our lives? The Jews have done it many times, and can do it again. There are millions of Jewish descendents of refugees from Arab countries that lost everything, not to mention the millions of descendents of refugees from the Holocaust. Can Arabs forget?

Posted by: Joao at May 23, 2006 12:11 AM

"The Palestinian law societies have boycotted Israeli courts from the beginning."

This is a lie. Palestinians on the West Bank have been continually going to the Israeli courts to try to get sections of the "Security" barrier rerouted so it doesn't slice their villages in two.

Posted by: Elizabeth at May 23, 2006 06:22 AM

The single cause of pain and suffering in the Mideast (and indeed in much of the world) is Islamic aggression and the Moslem view that whatever part of the world was once conquored by Islam must stay that way. Luckily, Israel and Spain are freed from Islam. Hopefully, more will follow (is India next?).

Posted by: Seymour Paine at May 23, 2006 01:10 PM

Joao, what do Arabs have to do with the Holocaust, really now.

Your question on whether Arabs can forget is very simplistic. Ok, war is wrong, let's all drop our guns and move on? Things don't work that way, the world doesn't work that way.

How can Arabs forget when Palestinians up until today are living in horrible conditions in the West Bank and Gaza strip. No country, horrible to non-existant economy, the list goes on. Real issues need to be solved before Peace can be achieved. Israel has a country, an economy, a society. What do the Palestinians have?

The problem is whether both sides are willing to compromise for Peace, which so far has not been the case. So it is not just about the Arabs forgeting, but about Arabs and Israelis finding a common ground solution, and that is the hardest part of all, one that may take another 50 years to come about.

Posted by: Omega80 at May 23, 2006 01:19 PM

Omega 80

So ie... your logic is "The Arab world should continue to villify and dehumanize the Israelis until both sides "clean up their act" and act almost perfectly"

The Israelis demonstrate an open mindedness and and surprising (to LP a Lebanese) informativeness of Arabs and the Arab world that the Arab cold war simplistic line totally lacks, even in Lebanon.

The point is the Israeli media and zeitgeist reads about and humanizes the Arab world while the Arab World - even Lebanon - is engaged in an outright Cold War simplistic villification. Michael and LP have both confirmed this.

I hate it when PC liberals show their hypocrisy while preaching.

LIZZY'S MANNAH DROPPING FROM HEAVEN -

This is a lie. Palestinians on the West Bank have been continually going to the Israeli courts to try to get sections of the "Security" barrier rerouted so it doesn't slice their villages in two.

Amazing that the Israeli courts would hear and sometimes rule in the Palestinians favor? More amazing they'll hold up construction that can (has) led to the brutal deaths of Israeli men, women and children.

QUESTION -
Can Palestinians, like in Gaza, who are having their houses demolished by the PLO go to Israeli or PA courts to stop that?

LOL!!

Mike

Posted by: Mike Nargizian at May 23, 2006 08:26 PM

Omega80:

"How can Arabs forget when Palestinians up until today are living in horrible conditions in the West Bank and Gaza strip."

Actually, by many of the accepted measures of well-being such as life expectancy, infant mortality and literacy rate, Palestinians are no worse off than many Arabs - and they are in fact much better off than the people of Iran, whose rulers are trying to get nuclear weapons to wipe out Israel presumably for the benefit of the Palestinians. Yes, their economic situation isn't so hot, but why should Israel let them across the border just so innocent people can get blown up?

Posted by: Gary Rosen at May 23, 2006 11:32 PM

Elisabeth: This is a lie. Palestinians on the West Bank have been continually going to the Israeli courts to try to get sections of the "Security" barrier rerouted so it doesn't slice their villages in two.

It isn't a lie, but it was from a rather out of date history book. I'm glad to see that the Palestinians are coming to their senses on this issue.

And sorry to see that you can't make a correction without being obnoxious about it - but then when haven't you been obnoxious?

Posted by: Josh Scholar at May 24, 2006 02:13 AM

i think, the world peace will finally take place when the israelis stop thinking that they r always the victims and the arabs are the terrotists.
"hey, we are the jews the upper race, and anybody else the...........(of course u know coz u invented it)"

Posted by: rita at May 25, 2006 12:38 PM

Rita, it probably isn't that simple.

Christians have the idea they're supposed to forgive. Jews and muslims don't.

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Doubtless when Israelis stop thinking that Arabs are out to kill them, Israelis will stop attacking them in self-defense.

This summer's conflict puts a different perspective on our Perpetual Refugee. He saw his family and acquaintances as weak and defeated, and decided that was unacceptable. He has made a value choice: that for him and his kind to have power over others is more important than ideals of universal peace, freedom, and prosperity, and rule of law. To him, Israelis are now the terrorists, and it doesn't matter one little bit that had it not been for Hezbollah's attacks and kidnappings, Israel would never have responded with a military offensive.

Of all the acts Hezbollah has perpetrated, the creation and perpetuation of lasting hatreds is the most despicable, and probably one of the outcomes its leader, Hassan Nasrallah, desired most.

The Perpetual Refugee is now lost to us, consumed by the very demons he tried so hard to escape from. Let us mourn.

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