I could care less about FEMA. Every day of my 'corporate' career I was always dancing on the fine line of insubordination.

I HATE bureaucracy. it invariably caters to the lowest possible denominators and operates on the elevation of process over results.

If FEMA screwed up and Brown was a part of that --- adios pal.

You have got to remember however, these are BUREAUCRACIES. It is not really the chief who runs things. It is the structure itself. Unless people have less to fear from actually THINKING than from bucking the systems in a good cause, you will always have the same problems. It's a JOB for these people; they simply can't piss away their careers by coloring outside the lines.They are not usually malicious nor even particularly dense in most cases. It's just that the RULES are the lifeblood of the system.

It's easy to judge; it's not so easy being there.

We will see.

One of my main gripes with Bush is that he never fires anyone. I like many of his people, but the ones who can't perform should be shown the door. Politely if possible, with a bootprint on the ass if necessary. Some things are more important than loyalty.

Color me unconvinced. There is a lot of the "fog of war" surrounding this tragedy still, and it's premature to call for anybody's termination.

It could be that the stories about FEMA this and FEMA that are false, and it could be that they had good reasons for the ones that are true.

So let's do what we can to help the needy and leave the recriminations for next week.

And when we get to that point, Kathleen Blanco and C. Ray Nagin are higher on my list than Brown.

Sorry, Michael, but the Wal-Mart truck story turned out not to have been the case..

A lot of the other horror stories are turning out to be false too.

Maybe you should lie down with a cool cloth on your forehead before you hyperventilate?

Sorry Charlie but that Redstate article is hardly the last word. What do you think a WalMart PR flack is going to say? (And I'm not attacking WalMart, I'm attacking PR flacks). And where was the water and fuel diverted to that was so critically important? Has anyone revealed that info?

I really cannot understand the mind-set of someone who would spend their time defending FEMA. Defending Bush against scurrilous attacks may be a worthwhile cause, but defending an incompetent bureacracy run by a man who is clearly unqualified for the job by any standard known to man is just ludicrous no matter what your political beliefs. Trent Lott is attacking FEMA, there are not going to be a lot of defenders of Brown at the end of the day.

And Richard, maybe you're unaware of this but the President does not have the authority to fire Blanco and Nagin. I'm quite sure the people will have their say at the ballot box and Blanco will be gone by the next election cycle. As to Nagin, remember that he was a staunch Bush supporter in the 2000 elections. Maybe that will mollify your opinion of him.

Michael, it may all be true and then you’re right... but a few days after a disaster this big? No one knows what the facts are. It's too early to call for resignations. We not only have the natural fog created by all this chaos, we have the partisan fog of spin... Let’s let a bipartisan commission look over everything, verify the facts, and then draw conclusions...

At this point, I wouldn't bet 'the farm' or 'my life' that all your examples really when down exactly as presented or, even happened at all (example: no one can seem to find a helicopter pilot who remember actually being shot at).

But anyway, after the facts are known, if there is widespread fema mishaps, then sure, I'm not vested in the guy, dump him...

Sorry, Michael, but the Wal-Mart truck story turned out not to have been the case.

It is a bit odd that so many of these stories come out of LA. It is in the same FEMA zone as Texas and things seem to have gone off well there. The way Houston in particular has dealt with refugees from NO seems to have been outstanding. Likewise, MS, AL, and FL are together in a neighboring zone and I don't hear that many complaints (any?) from there. So I guess we will have to wait. LA is a mess in so many different ways it is hard to know what is going on. The politicians there sure don't help clarify things.

As to Nagin, remember that he was a staunch Bush supporter in the 2000 elections. Maybe that will mollify your opinion of him.--Vanya

Nope.

What do you think a WalMart PR flack is going to say?

Well, vanya, maybe you should just have a lie down till the revolution comes along or something. I had no sense that the lady in question was a PR "flack" even if she was in public relations. At this point I am more inclined to see you in that role.

As to Nagin, remember that he was a staunch Bush supporter in the 2000 elections. Maybe that will mollify your opinion of him.

What does that have to do with anything? Not everybody is like your glorious self.

Chuck,

Everyone who works in PR is a "flack", that is what a flack is.

It doesn't look like Michael Brown is terribly competent, but FEMA's record is lousy. I won't bore y'all with anecdotes about FEMA's failures in Florida, but I do recall reading some quite nasty stories about FEMA's poor track record in one of James Bovard's books. He was ranting about FEMA during the Clinton years, but I imagine the bureaucracy has changed little since then.

From where I'm sitting, the government at all levels has done a less-than-stellar job. Still, dealing with something like this isn't supposed to be easy, and I'm not sure why people expect instant healing. We can point fingers, scream racism, curse the government, and throw more money at incompetent bureaucrats after we've dealt with the emergency.

i used to live in nola.

i woldn;t trust one word of any connected local politician.

nagin, blanco, broussard - they are ALL probably neck deep in political shenangigans as foul as the floodwaters.

and they attack FEMA and Bish to cover up their PERSONAL negligence.

tell me Mikey: how do you send 50,000 people to sjhelters that have no extra food or water!?

how come you don't use the 600 buses to get car-less people evacuated!?

why don;t you say BEFOREHAND that looters will be dealt with ruthlessly!?

blanco and nagin should be shot. okay, i hperbolize: they shopjhld be fired and tried for gross negligence.

as a dem who went to tulane i am ASHAMED.

BTW: the city will be rebuilt: smaller, richer, and better than before. no projects. no 9th ward.
better infrastructure. more cops. all honest.

Just watched the Daily Show (where would our news media be without it?) and saw the clip of Bush with FEMA head Michael Brown. Bush said to him, "You're doing a great job, Brownie." Aww, that's cute, he calls him Brownie. Just like the way he called Ken Lay "Kenny Boy". He's good to his friends, you have to say that about him.

Just watched the Daily Show (where would our news media be without it?) and saw the clip of Bush with FEMA head Michael Brown. Bush said to him, "You're doing a great job, Brownie." Aww, that's cute, he calls him Brownie. Just like the way he called Ken Lay "Kenny Boy". He's good to his friends, you have to say that about him.--John Mc

Ah. What passes for intellectual debate on the doofus side of the political spectrum, shows up.
Ad hominem argumentation buttressed by snide allegations based upon 'facts not in evidence'.
A reference to Enron in the midst of a natural disaster.

You guys are certifiable.

Let's assume for the sake of argument that all the "FEMA screwup" stories turn out to be true. Assume these are not isolated mistakes that will happen in any serious undertaking, but a systemic problem.

In this case, Brown should be fired. However, much more importantly, wide swaths of the upper, and perhaps lower, levels of FEMA should be fired. The best way to fix a systemically flawed bureaucracy is to fire it. Not just the top guy but the entire management.

One of the 1980's corporate raiders noted that he could routinely double the value of a company overnight simply by firing its management.

Just firing Brown sounds like a way to make Michael feel better. The plan should be to make FEMA perform better.

Freddom is on the march!

There is a fairly straightforward argument for dropping Brown regardless of his culpability. I don't remember exactly who it was -- Bradley or Eisenhower -- but one of the two removed an officer from command with the simple explanation that they had lost confidence in him. Not that he was necessarily incompetent, simply that no matter what an investigation might show, they had lost confidence in him. A commander needs to have confidence in his subordinates and we the people need to have confidence in FEMA.

So the argument can be made. I don't know what a thorough investigation would show, but I think Brown could usefully consider spending more time with his family. He is not irreplaceable and he could very easily become a sideshow that distracts attention from more important things.

I think maybe it was the Louisianna FEMA that was turning back people and goods not the federal FEMA. I don't think they do guard duty.

Michael...

You know I'm not a partisan hack saying this, but: I lay the greater responsibility for this on the back of governing philosophy dominant in this country for the last 25 years. The conservatives of this modern era are just as bad off as the liberals of 1970s. They've sold us on the demagogic idea of government as an absolute evil in very much the same way the liberals of yester-year sold us on the demagogic notion of government as an absolute good. Everything in this country has swung so far to the Right, it seems we've totally lost the concept of a government big and efficient enough to get the job done.

I miss Bill Clinton something fierce in these moments. I tell ya, looking back: had that man possessed a bit more spine in the realm of foreign affairs, he would have made the perfect commander-in-chief.

I'd support firing Brown, but mainly on principle. When the crew screws up the captain carries the can for it; it's part of what he pays for the gold braid and all the salutes.

In point of actual fact, what I see in that litany has little or nothing to do with whether or not Brown could or did do his job. What I see is a typical bureaucracy in action -- it doesn't matter one whit what (if anything) gets done; it matters that the paperwork is filled out properly and filed through the proper channels, and everyone concerned is authorized, through channels, by those authorized to authorize people, to fill out and file the paperwork. Look up an old Eric Frank Russel story, A Study in Still Life.

If the paperwork on file says that the Coast Guard is supposed to give the fuel to agency A, if agency B shows up they're SOL -- and the fact that A is still in Chicago (or wherever) has nothing to do with anything. The gas belongs to A. It says so right there on the form.

The process is as inexorable as glaciers. The only truly amazing thing about it is that there are still people who think turning control over to bureaucracies is a wonderful thing to do.

Regards,
Ric

I can imagine Bush letting Brown go because he'd "lost confidence in him" ... later. Besides little details like no one can seem to actually name anything FEMA has done wrong (as opposed to, say, buses flooded in a parking lot), if Bush fired him now, it wouldn't reduce the political storm, it would only encourage it.

Charlie,

if Bush fired him now, it wouldn't reduce the political storm, it would only encourage it.

Maybe so. This whole thing is already so political that it feels like we've all been dipped in Louisiana slime. One state, one disaster, and a nationwide contagion. Louisiana politicians and their media enablers have done their best to make this whole disaster political. So you may be right. But there is a long ugly fight brewing that I don't expect to end before the 2006 elections and I don't want to carry around any baggage.

Broussard was in some sort of big legal trouble before this happened. He may not be an entirely reliable witness.

Brown's efforts during hurricane season in Florida last year were highly regarded, so much so that when Bush sent Jeb to Asia during the tsunami the left were saying that he should have sent Brown because he was clearly the person with the experience. Now they want his head. So what is the truth here, Mr. Totten? Don't rush to judgement, because there are lot of people trying to politicize this or cover their asses to hide the ineptitude. FEMA, DHS and the Bush administration are a consensus target for the LA and national Dem pols and the news media.

As for firing people because of (not necessarily well founded) public/media/opposition uproar, I generally think it is bad idea. I think it reduces the likelihood of attracting people to high profile, high pressure, and highly political jobs like this.

As for Clinton, I really don't think there is anything in his adminstration's record that indicates that they would perform better in situations like this, as they never faced anything similar in scope and magnitude. And don't forget the domestic warts like Waco and Ruby Ridge. And let's not forget that one of Clinton's FEMA heads was an advisor to LA govt and had a role in their disaster planning. He had joined up with Blanco again during this crisis.

"Everything in this country has swung so far to the Right, it seems we've totally lost the concept of a government big and efficient enough to get the job done."

Huh ? NO Grant. Lets do something it is difficult for people on the Left to do. Let's look at the facts. Since Reagan was elected in 1980, there has indeed been a swing to the Right, but it has been largely rhetorical. Total taxation is not much lower than 25 years ago. There is been some deregulation of financial markets and some power has been returned to the states, but the overall size of the federal government is largely unchanged. Not one cabinet level agency has been dismantled, and very few sub-agencies have been eliminated.

The growth of government slowed in some respects in the 1980s, but Bush has expanded government. This disaster is the first test of this new monstrosity called Homeland Security, and it failed...as did the city of New Orleans and the state of Louisiana.

It is dishonest to say that this post-Katrina disaster occurred because government is too small, because SMALL GOVERNMENT HAS NOT BEEN TRIED YET !

Clarification...I should have stated that small government has not been tried IN THE MODERN ERA.

The size of government has EXPLODED in this country since the 1930s.

And those of you who are going to say that a big, complex society needs a large government have it WRONG. It is precisely BECAUSE modern society is so complex, with so much DISPERSED KNOWLEDGE and so many billions of decisions made on a daily basis, that a large centralized government is INCAPABLE of "managing" a sudden crisis like this, let alone an entire economy. Government decision-making needs to be decentralized and very limited, UNLESS the nation is threatened. That is why we have a Department of Defense. Most of the rest of it is a racket. And the politicians get away with things on a daily basis that would put any business person in the slammer.

“Broussard was in some sort of big legal trouble before this happened. He may not be an entirely reliable witness.”

That is saying it mildly. At this point in time, Broussard’s utterances should be taken with a huge grain of salt. Also, Michael Brown is placed in a very awkward situation: if he tells the truth to the media---he will embarrass Ray Nagin and Kathleen Babineaux Blanco. The man is damned if he does, and damned if he doesn't. I doubt very much he was lying about feeding people in the Silverdome, but honestly mistaken. Most city emergency officials do not send citizens to rescue areas without adequate water, food, and toilet facilities.

FEMA is not the first or even second responder. The city and state authorities are supposed to handle matters for the first 48 to 72 hours. They failed miserably. Contrary to what some people seem to believe, we do not live in a dictatorship. The federal government does not possess the right to push aside Louisiana's elected officials.

Michael: This is what you wanted when you backed Bush last fall. "I don't trust John Kerry on terrorism." Instead, you trusted these people. You don't think the sleeper cells got a 500% morale boost from watching Chertoff and Brown this past week? You won't catch me on an American mass transit system any time soon, friend.

And enjoy reading the latest bile from your fellow Bush supporters in these comments. How a thoughtful guy like you winds up in bed with these folks is beyond me.

At the risk of irritating our host Michael Totten---I am going to award FEMA with a B grade for its efforts so far. The initial anger seems grossly unjustified. This federal agency is not the first responder. It is also legally obligated to essentially kiss the ass of the city and state authorities! FEMA was created to support these elected officials and not shove them out of the way. It should be judged on what it accomplishes after the first 48-72 hours, and not the immediate aftermath of the crisis. Normally, the third responder like FEMA is not confronted by such outrageous incompetence of the local elected officials.

Yes indeed, I think FEMA earns a B. Am I butt kisser of the Bush administration? Am I too generous with my grading? Oh well, please feel free to take me to task.

A senator from Mississippi, whose own house had been demolished by the storm, tries to effectively hijack a significant chunk of FEMA's Atlanta logistics tail in the heat of the moment, and the fact that FEMA told him to get the hell out of their hair is cited as an example of FEMA's obstructionism and incompetence? I bloody well think not!

All of those stories seem to either be variants on the "FEMA didn't let me do whatever the hell I wanted to do" complaints by people grabbing for the nearest resources in plain sight, or examples of "the devil unplugged my phone lines", with "devil" replaced with "FEMA". I'm sure FEMA has made a number of really bad errors - it isn't exactly a bureau with the best of reputations - but all of this telephone-game yammering is deeply nonproductive and corrosive.

There'll be time for this crap next month, while we're waiting as New Orleans is drained and decontaminated. Right now, it's about two steps up from rumor-mongering.

Let me get this straight.

American right-wingers were able to politicize a blow-job, but think a “dickless” government that ignores the death of thousands upon thousands of Americans is virtuous?

American right-wingers obsess about the hordes of radical Islamists detonating thousands of dirty-bombs in our cities, but believe other disasters should be ignored?

American right-wingers hate government so much, they believe the only people who can run it, are folks who pretend to hate it as much as they do?

American right-wingers want to use the evil government to democratize the Middle East?

American right-wingers were able to politicize a blow-job, but think a “dickless” government that ignores the death of thousands upon thousands of Americans is virtuous?--NeoDude

Why bother to comment when this kind of self-amusing drivel speaks largely for itself. This is the 'left's' contribution to civic debate. Yesterday it was references to Fellating Bush from the 'intellectual wing' and today we get NeoDude travelling much the same well-worn pathway. What is with you guys and this particular anological concept?

Are all your 'brains' indeed truly 'in your pants'? If so, I dare say you appear somewhat under-equipped ,if you know what I mean.Inquiring minds once again want to know.

The good news is that you guys are no longer heading over the cliff. The bad news is that you are now in free fall.

Happy Landings.

Michael,

This post and this thread fall under the heading of ... The Politics of the Last Five Minutes.

I love the dichotomy.

Hindrocket, Malkin, et al: Some perfidious liberal might have done something evil!

Hacks: That traitor!

Overwhelming evidence: A Bush crony fucked up beyond description, and people are dead as a result.

Hacks: Well, let's not be too hasty to judge! Let's wait for all the evidence to roll in. In the mean time, did you hear about that treasonous liberal?

Commenter,

These folks have registered with FEMA and aren't complaining. They are out there doing good work. Why not drop by and hit the pay-pal button to help them out?

I've already donated more than I can probably afford.

But, that's beside the point. What is the point is this:

On the one hand, you have lots of unsubstantiated rumors propagated by hacks like Malkin, Powerline, Instapundit (disturbing, if true) that people seize upon as the perfidy of liberals.

On the other hand, you have a lot of people claiming that FEMA really dropped the ball. And by "dropped the ball", I mean "fucked up beyond all comprehension".

Now, I'm not saying that FEMA got everything wrong, just a lot. But, again, that's not the point. You've got a lot of people saying "FEMA bad!" and a couple saying "FEMA ok", and the general response from conservatives is "hey, whoa, let's slow down there! Can't we wait until we have all the facts?"

It's a study in contrasts: the willingness to believe individual, tertiary sources who say bad things about people you already dislike, and a scepticism of primary sources saying bad things about someone you do like (the Bush administration in general).

I believe there are some terms associated with this sort of thing: "selection bias" and "partisan hack" come to mind...

I mean, can you imagine John Kerry getting the benefit of the doubt?

"Some soldiers who tangentially knew Kerry in Vietnam and who are currently being funded by a PR firm run by long-time friends of Karl Rove are saying bad things about John Kerry."

"Well! Let's wait until all the facts are in before we pass judgement. After all, choosing who you'll vote for president is a serious decision, warranting lots of careful thought."

And Doug, you have to remember: your case of Bush-Fellating Syndrome is a serious disease. Medical attention is warranted. As I've said, this is in no way meant as a rhetorical dirty-trick, whereby I smugly dismiss any legitimate and serious support for Bush as a "syndrome" involving you "sucking his dick", shutting down any discussion as condescendingly as possible. No, honestly. If you could just look past his crotch, you might see that every opinion you have is wrong and not the result of reason or analysis, but rather of this "syndrome" which I made up yesterday.

In other words, admit that "BDS" is as asinine an idea as "BFS", or be condemned for ever as "cock breath".

Yo Commenter.You are fond of snap polls. Thought you might like to see this. And this is after the full-court press the totally useless media ran ALL last week. Want to bet on the likely results when more actual facts come out? The same poll indicated that 63% did NOT want firings to take place NOW.

Gallup Poll: Who's To Blame? (Results)
--No One: 38%
--State/Local Officials: 25%
--Federal Agencies: 18%
--President Bush: 13%

Those damn citizens ---- can't they do anything RIGHT !!!!

Doug, I'm not sure why you keep talking about stuff like that. You mention snap-polls which indicate that people are not primarily blaming Bush. You criticize me for not being politically savvy, because Bush will wiggle his way out of this one too. Blah blah fucking blah.

Doug, I never said "what follows is a prediction of the electoral chances of Republicans in the future as a result of the perception of their handling of this crisis".

What I said was "lots of people fucked up, including Louisiana Democrats, but more importantly the national Republican Party, which controls the most powerful institution in the world, yet did little to help until days after people started saying 'hey, where's that gubmint we keep payin' for?' - and, as a result of their mess, everyone culpable deserves the consequences."

In other words, I hope a lot of people lose their elected or appointed offices - I hope that a few people hang. I hope, and I never said that I did any more than that, because if the people responsible - the mayor, the governor, the President, the head of FEMA - don't suffer as a result of their mistakes, then, somehow, my disillusionment will achieve infinite levels.

Hey, maybe then I can transcend space and time or something cool like that.

Does that clear things up, cock breath?

Does that clear things up, cock breath?--Commenter

Can't talk now, my mouth is kinda full.

ps-- I post some these things to annoy you, and to correct the 'factual'errors you are prone to make. Such as for example "On the other hand, you have a lot of people claiming that FEMA really dropped the ball. And by "dropped the ball", I mean "fucked up beyond all comprehension". Clearly a lot of people are NOT saying that as opposed to saying something entirely different.

Fact are often inconvenient little things.

pps-- If you do manage to 'transcend time & space', can you share some of the ill-gotten gains you would be privy to?

It is silly to expect FEMA to be very good -- but the fastest way to make it MUCH BETTER, is to fire the chief.
For loss of confidence.
Immediately.

Policitally, as a sacrifice.
And then to reflect the continuing criticism: well, Bush did his job -- he fired the less-than stellar top Bozo. Now, when will Nagin and Blanco be fired? And what ARE the facts?

When the Left is more interested in the facts, and the honest responsibilities, than on firing Bush (or any Bush friends), than they'll be doing constructive criticism.

CNNUSATODAYGALLUP POLL: ONLY 13% BLAME BUSH
Wed Sep 07 2005 10:42:26 ET

"A CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll shows:

Blame Game -- 13% said George W. Bush is "most responsible for the problems in New Orleans after the hurricane"; 18% said "federal agencies"; 25% said "state and local officials"; 38% said "no one is to blame"; 6% had no opinion. -- 29% said that "top officials in the federal agencies responsible for handling emergencies should be fired"; 63% said they should not; 8% had no opinion."

The bushitler haters must be spitting nails. The plebes have stopped listening!

miss Bill Clinton something fierce in these moments. I tell ya, looking back: had that man possessed a bit more spine in the realm of foreign affairs, he would have made the perfect commander-in-chief.

Clinton was a masterful politician-- the best in the bidness-- but he accomplished nothing in office except to inherit the dotcom boom and a rising economy.

The only things he'd be doing differently right now is hugging more black babies and more photo ops, and of course blaming the GOP congress like he did for everything.

What I said was "lots of people fucked up, including Louisiana Democrats, but more importantly the national Republican Party, which controls the most powerful institution in the world, yet did little to help until days after people started saying 'hey, where's that gubmint we keep payin' for?' - and, as a result of their mess, everyone culpable deserves the consequences....In other words, I hope a lot of people lose their elected or appointed offices - I hope that a few people hang. I hope, and I never said that I did any more than that--Commenter
=============================================

Ummm, Not exactly. What you SAID was ---
If any conceivable good will come out of this, it will be two-fold:
First, it will have exposed the utter and total incompetence and failure of the Bush administration.
Second, it will have exposed the utter and total moral failure of anyone who is falling over themselves to blame anyone - the mayor, the governor, those damn people who just didn't walk out of the city when they were told to, whoever -anyone but the people who are, in fact, responsible.--Commenter

These are NOT 'hope' statements; they are statements of absolute(albeit future related) results. Really historical revisionism should probably wait longer than 24 hours before kicking into effect, don't you think? Or are my English-language skills as well as my morals in question?

But, Doug, don't you get that Bush's failures have already been exposed, over and over, and people still like him? Just enough, you know, to have kept him in office?

But the second still stands: the moral failure of people whose sole focus is protecting Bush (anybody's fault except the most powerful man in the world, and so forth) has also been exposed. Which is why I feel comfortable calling you bad words, because, you know, I tend to not really care about what moral failures think of me.

So, to answer your question, no, neither your English skills or your morals are in question. Tom Grey, there's a guy who writes like he's not a native speaker. I have no problems with your English skills. And I don't have any questions about your morals, either. You answered them for me.

David Thomson,
I would agree with your assessment. I think to this point FEMA has done good. Not great, but good. They are not set up to step into a situation where the local authorities have pretty much completey abdicated.

Says Berube to Democrats:

The Bush Administration’s failure to provide adequate relief for victims of Katrina is a political issue through and through. Timorous Democrats, please take note. Bush/Cheney based their entire 2004 campaign, at least the official version, on the premise that they and they alone could protect Americans from terrorist attacks, and they slandered your ticket accordingly. (The unofficial version of the campaign, you’ll recall, involved the Swift Boat Vets—see “very slimy waters,” above.) Cheney gave the speech time and again: electing Kerry meant certain, fiery death. Remember those wolves gathering in the forest? The extra wolves they didn’t use in The Day After Tomorrow? Well, it turns out that the Bush crew can’t protect you from wolves. It can’t even get pallets of food, water, and medicine to sick, starving people in New Orleans. It can’t plan for a disaster that everyone, everyone in “disaster management” anticipated.

According to this Southern Democrat

A common comment, at home and abroad, to the scenes broadcast from New Orleans, was, ‘My God, it looks like Haiti.’ (I note that in fact, Mississippi was hit harder by the actual hurricane, but the news is skewed – think of it as analogous to the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle – by the fact that the news crews chose to go to New Orleans. I also note that the crews were imbedded there before the storm hit, and that moving an anchorman is logistically much easier than moving a division of troops.)

Yes, many of the scenes did look like something from Haiti. The reason is simple. To paraphrase Liebling, Louisiana is the only banana republic in the US...

...It is only within the past five to ten years that the NOPD has finally ceased accepting convicted felons as police officers.

The murder rate and crime rate in NO are off the charts. No other Southern city has remained thus crippled. Then again, no other Southern city is as infested by corruption, mafiosi, and graft. Nagin’s predecessor’s family spent most of the past summer getting indicted, and that’s commonplace in Louisiana and NO politics. Chicago at its worst was less corrupt.

According to Human Rights watch:

The New Orleans Police Department has been rocked by successive scandals during the past several years: an officer was convicted in April 1996 of hiring a hit man to kill a woman who had lodged a brutality complaint against him and another officer was convicted in September 1995 for robbing a Vietnamese restaurant and shooting, execution style, a brother and sister who worked there, as well as an off-duty officer from her precinct working as security at the restaurant. In addition, at least fifty of the 1,400-member force have been arrested for felonies including homicide, rape, and robberies since 1993.1 As astutely noted by police abuse expert Prof. James Fyfe, some cities' police departments have reputations for being brutal, like Los Angeles, or corrupt, like New York, and still others are considered incompetent. New Orleans has accomplished the rare feat of leading nationally in all categories.

The world has known about the Haiti-style corruption in New Orleans' government for many years. Even you must have known about it. Yet you fail to mention it. Is this because you're too busy fellating these organizations?

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

I have no interest in defending the obviously incompetent members of FEMA or the Bush administration. Nor do I have any interest in defending the homicidally incompetent local government. But I am offended by your overwhelming homophobia. Why do you unthinkingly link presumed corruption and sin to homosexuality? Why does the idea fill you with such rage? These are questions that only a therapist can answer.

But, Doug, don't you get that Bush's failures have already been exposed, over and over, and people still like him? Just enough, you know, to have kept him in office?

Commenter,

because the bushitler haters blame Bush for everything including hurricanes, tsunamis and earthquakes doesn't mean Bush's "failures have already been exposed." The poll numbers would in fact suggest otherwise. In other words, you're just begging the question when you state something as fact like that, which by the way I've noticed you do a lot. You take the issue in contention, you rephrase it in overly-long, essay-length posts and present it as a statement of fact-- but it isn't a fact, but still an issue in contention. It just goes to show that quantity isn't the same as quality.

But the second still stands: the moral failure of people whose sole focus is protecting Bush (anybody's fault except the most powerful man in the world, and so forth) has also been exposed. Which is why I feel comfortable calling you bad words, because, you know, I tend to not really care about what moral failures think of me.

you could have just called him a poopy face and spared your carpal tunnels the effort.

If you right-wingers would spend as much time defending the nation as you do defending Bush, there would be a lot of living Americans, right now.

I guess Bush's political life is more precious than the average American's life.

Mary,

Isn’t’ pedophilia and incestuous rape highest in Mississippi?

“David Thomson,
I would agree with your assessment. I think to this point FEMA has done good. Not great, but good. They are not set up to step into a situation where the local authorities have pretty much completey abdicated.”

FEMA’s role is severely limited to the support of the local authorities. The elected officials are suppose to have their act together. FEMA is the third responder, not the first nor second! Too many people seem to think that the federal government has the right to tell the governor of Louisiana and the mayor of New Orleans to go sexual intercourse themselves. Sigh, it appears that they might need to learn more about the American Constitution and the principle of federalism.

"They are not set up to step into a situation where the local authorities have pretty much completey abdicated."

If that's true, that's a pretty damning indictment of the way FEMA is set up. Imagine jihadists detonate a pocket nuke at city hall in a medium size American city, instantly wiping out most of the senior local authorities. You're telling me FEMA is not prepared to step in if that happens. Well, that's reassuring. The first assumption in a major disaster - earthquake, hurricane, terrorist attack - should be that local authorities will be overwhelmed and unprepared. We have a Federal government for that very reason, we're stronger as a Union than as individual states.

Objectively speaking FEMA has done a very bad job, whether you blame FEMA's internal problems on Bush, Clinton, or Eisenhower isn't really the main issue, the issue is that FEMA needs to be fixed going forward. Maybe if you judge FEMA by the internal standards of their own bureacratic charter they're doing just fine, but that is meaningless to us taxpayers. Clearly this agency needs to be overhauled in a major way.

Isn’t’ pedophilia and incestuous rape highest in Mississippi?

When did you stop beating your wife?

Are pedophiles and incestuous rapists employed as "first responders" in Mississippi?

If they're not, (and even if they were) your question is pointless.

For the record:

I do, in fact, believe that local government shares blame, and have written several times that I think just that. I'm kind of confused why you think otherwise, Mary, but maybe you're not talking to me?

I don't link fellatio to homosexuality - considering the fact that, you know, lots of straight men and women do it. Bush-Fellating Syndrome is not homophobic in the least. Women can suck just as well as men. The fact that you link fellatio (in the abstract) with homosexuality says something about YOU, Mary, don't you think? HA! We can play the "let's pretend we're psychiatrists" game all day!

Doug, Carlos just called you "Poopy Face". Are you going to take that? Huh? Are you? Come on, stand up for yourself, Poopy Face!

But, for just the briefest of moments, some seriousness: no one, except for a very small number of people (a lot of them, oddly, German) has suggested a connection between Bush and the weather. To argue that people who don't like Bush are blaming him for natural disasters is, then, a strawman: people are critical of his response to the disaster, not for the disaster itself. Sort of like, disagreeing about the strategies necessary to defeat our enemies overseas does not mean that liberals love Saddam and think he's a swell guy.

And, of course, poll numbers only indicate the wisdom of the masses when the masses agree with you. If they disagree with you, it's because of the evil liberal bias of the MSM who hate America and democracy and puppies. Duh.

commenter - I was only offering a non-professional evaluation of your condition. Only a therapist can offer a real, and very helpful evaluation.

“You're telling me FEMA is not prepared to step in if that happens.”

This is why we have elections in this country. Your local elected officials are obligated to be your first line of assistance. FEMA inherently can never be anything more than a backup to the local officials.

FEMA can indeed step in the primary leadership role if the local political establishment has been killed or put out of commission. However, the last time I checked both the governor of Louisiana and mayor of New Orleans are alive and well. Do you know something I don’t?

Blank,
You apparently are unaware of the disaster response structure. The local entities are always supposed to be the first responders; FEMA is not designed to get in until 3-4 days after the disaster. The states have their own resources available, such as the National Guard.

What do you think FEMA should have at it's disposal? You would need at least 10 regional centers (because there might be multiple disasters in wide-spread locations, and you would want short transit times for the response personnel), each with about 200,000 deployable (24 hour notice) personnel (you would need so many because they would need to be able to manage everything for any of, what, a dozen different scenarios), all the support staff that they would require (which would likely be another 200K at least). Each center would have to have all the airlift capability it needed, along with massive amounts of firefighting equipment (because the disaster they are responding to might be large-scale forest fires), complete sets of contruction equipment (cranes, bulldozers, earth movers, etc.) and the associated transportation, because the disaster might be an earthquake, field hospitals (and associated medical personnel) that could handle 20K sick, because the disaster might be an epidemic of some sort, hundreds of small boats, because the disaster might be another flood, etc.

Or is it smarter to have the locals prepare for the most likely disaster that is going to occur in their area, and handle the initial response?

And, of course, poll numbers only indicate the wisdom of the masses when the masses agree with you.

Well they certainly don't indicate that Bush's alleged failures have been "exposed" now do they, unless you're saying the poll is completely false.

OT, I dig how to the Left, people are "the masses". It's revealing. A Lib buddy of mine calls democracy "rule by mob" (he used that very term) to justify and excuse his support for activist Liberal judges usurping the legislatures. This kind of elitism which is revealed in the terms you use and the attitudes you hold is why you've failed to get regular folks to go along with your agendas even when you bribe them with goodies.

Doug, Carlos just called you "Poopy Face". Are you going to take that? Huh? Are you? Come on, stand up for yourself, Poopy Face!--Commenter

Geez even in jest you manage to distort reality. Or would you consider it merely interpreting reality. Carlos was merely suggesting you boil down your juvenile ad hominen assaults to the lowest common denominator and save yourself potential wrist injury.

He was thinking of YOU man. It takes a lot for us moral degenerates to go that extra mile. Cut him some slack. He's trying.

And FYI, between we members of the VRWC, ' poopy face' is pretty much a term of endearment. You know like 'turd blossom' is for our GREAT LEADER, the all-knowing,all-seeing, Lord Rove.

Again, Mary, not sure where you're coming from here. There's no homophobia involved - my "Bush-Fellatio Syndrome" can afflict men and women. It has nothing to do with sex, and everything to do with a bullshit debating tactic whereby one person automatically dismisses the other person as being "hysterical" (Bush-Derangement Syndrom) or "with their face held to Bush's crotch" (Bush-Fellatio Syndrome). I see fellatio as an equal-opportunity pastime.

Carlos,

Yeah, that's it. Because I said "the masses", I'm an evil elitist who really hates the common folk. Let's review a couple of things:

- Your liberal friend uses the term "rule by mob" to describe democracy. The Founding Fathers used language very similar in the Federalist Papers. Carlso, why do you hate America?

- I love how all you need to understand what "The Left" thinks is a sentence from me and a term from you friend. I figure that by "The Left" you're referring to the 60,000,000 or so people who voted for Kerry - or is there another definition you're using? - which should give you a margin of error of roughly, say, 100%.

- I love how, while accusing me of elitist disconnect from "regular folks", you state that those who support liberal agendas do so only because they're bribed. Right, because that's not the condescending statement of the year.

- Who exactly are these "regular folks" you describe, with whom liberals cannot connect? Is it rich people? Because, well, if by "regular folks" you mean "the richest of the rich", then you're right, because Bush overwhelmingly won among the richest of the rich, and lost among the poorest of the poor. But one would think that, when tens of millions of people voted for each candidate and, in fact, only a tiny fraction of the entire electorate voted for one candidate over the other (and when that fraction was reversed just four years ago), that the problem is not that liberals cannot connec with "regular folks", but rather that elections in America are increasingly decided by razor-thin margins of voters near the center, politicall, and not by some vast mass of "regular folks" who just can't stand those goddamn fucking elitist ivory tower Volvo-driving, latte-sipping, New York Times-reading liberals.

- Liberals aren't the only ones who love activist judges. One branch of the California legislature just voted to legalize gay marriage. Arnold said he's veto the bill if it passes both houses. This sort of thing, he said, should be decided by people who know the law, the judges.

- I guess that's about it.

David,

If you're getting dizzy from spinning so hard, why don't you read this. http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050906-093817-7903r.htm

Here's the conclusion:
"In the wake of the disastrous initial responses to the Katrina disaster, the self-congratulatory conclusion asserted in the preface of the response plan is particularly disturbing. 'The end result is vastly improved coordination among federal, state, local and tribal organizations to help save lives and protect America's communities by increasing the speed, effectiveness and efficiency of incident management.' By FEMA's own description of its mission, they failed." (my bold).

Don't let the Bush haters sucker you into defending the indefensible.

Sorry, Doug. I get so carried away sometimes. I totally thought he was calling you a Poopy Face, and we were just starting to build some kind of messed-up odd-couple sort of relationship, and I wanted to defend you. You know how it is. Bash each other all day long, but friends to the end.

And I forgot about Bush's love for weird, insulting nick-names. What's with that? Is it because he thinks like a 14-year-old? Is it his way of establishing dominance over everyone around him, especially those closest to him, by constantly insulting them?

The VRWC is weird. YOU PEOPLE ARE WEIRD.

You know how it is. Bash each other all day long, but friends to the end.--Commenter

I actually have 'enjoyed' these little interludes, Not quite as much as root canal, but nonetheless-----

Just another FYI, the problem with the 'politics of rage' as someday the leftist loons will discover is that it usually leads not to dropping everything at the end of the day and heading out for a beer. It leads to something altogether more serious.

The type of politics practised by the KosKids, and Move-On.clueless,and I admit by extremists on the other side as well, is destructive of the civic compact.

When I say that I can't stand the loons, I am really not being hyperbolic. I think they are both dangerous and unseemly, and I have zero tolerance for them and zero interest in listening to their ceaseless babble.

I have to confess that you is not they. You have a sense of humour which is invaluable in these difficult times. Sorry for any attribution otherwise. I just think you should spend more time castigating the 'loons' so that people don't make a natural mistook.

But these are the internets! I can do whatever I want, I hide behind my anonymity! It totally worked for that Mark Twain, and George Orwell...we'll probably never know their real names...

But these are the internets! I can do whatever I want, I hide behind my anonymity! It totally worked for that Mark Twain, and George Orwell...we'll probably never know their real names...--Commenter

LOL. Don't answer the door, whatever you do.

Ooops, did I say that out loud ?

Nevermind.

Ah, so now you're coming at me with the rhetoric of eliminationism?

I shouldn't be surprised by that, you Ur-Fascist.

You disgust me, Poopy Face.

Chuck,

The way Houston in particular has dealt with refugees from NO seems to have been outstanding.

Thanks, but much of that has come from the large number of individuals willing to step up, give and help - the ratio of volunteer health care workers (from the nearby Texas Medical Center) to refugees was something like 5:1 this weekend, and about half of my lab took leave to go help out. Most reports from them involved high levels of disorganisation at the outset, and people who showed up with food (BBQ mostly - this IS Texas, after all) being turned away by officials due to liabilty concerns. Individuals stepped up and self-organised the food/bedding collection and distribution here, not the gov., though our mayor has shown strong leadership in finding as much space for refugees as he could. Credit where credit is due.

A good way to make a densely populated disaster zone worse is to allow every well-intentioned guy and gal and their brother and sister to run into the burning building without good training and with resources to offer just enough help to give the stranded something to fight over. You start with one problem and you quickly have three (the original, the now imperiled rescuer-wannabes, and the fights on the ground over insufficient resources).

By the time you're pleading on TV for FEMA to go faster, your region has already failed at preparing itself.

Now is a good time for people to look at their own local and regional governments, ask themselves what kind of disaster preparedness is needed at that level, then dig in and find out why it isn't happening. What beurocratic, budgeting, and authority gaps keep preparedness in your region a topic which, for the most part, gets the "tut, tut. Yup, that'll be bad. Our hands are tied, though." treatment that typifies the situation?

-t

Commenter,

Like doug, I also appreciate your wit, and you're a fantastic writer too, but that apparently doesn't translate into intellectual honesty and substance.

Don't flatter yourself that the 60 million people who voted for Kerry are on "the Left", anymore than you'd flatter me by saying everybody who voted for Bush is a religious rightwinger. When I say the Left, and I point out their elitism, you know exactly who I'm talking about.

When our Founding Fathers referred to "mob rule" they were talking about direct democracy, and that's exactly why they came up with Representative Democracy. Apparently that wasn't good enough for you Lefties.

Ah, forgive me, Señor Carlos, for not being able to read your mind and understand what you meant by the ill-defined term "Left". What, then, is your definition, since the most convenient way apparent to me is simply "who voted for whom in the last election"?

Because if you're using the term to mean "someone who reads Democratic Underground and Indymedia", well, you're way off, and it makes you sound silly to call me a "Leftie".

But, again, Carlos: it's rich to be lectured to about elitism when you believe, apparently, that many of the supporters of the Democratic Party do so because they are bribed, and not because of any principled moral, political, ethical, or logical stand. Nothing says "I respect the average American" like "you only made that decision based on the most primitive greed".

Anyway, since you didn't get it in the first place, my use of the term "masses" was meant to be flippant. I remember, back in the lead-up to the War in Iraq, hearing about how the American people get it because they supported the war. In other words, the wisdom of the common folk, those simple, plain folks, was greater than those egghead ivory tower liberal elitist pussies. One does not, however, hear similar talk when opinion polls swing away from Bush, et al. I can't really imagine hearing that the American people "get" something when opinion polls all show that people don't particularly like Bush anymore. No, actually, the most common explantion heard when opinion polls start to go against conservatives (or "the Right", or whatever the hell you are) is that people have been tricked by the dread MSM with their evil anti-puppy bias. If only, IF ONLY they could hear about that school we painted in Basra, then I just KNOW they'd love us again!

So, yes, I imagine that in the minds of a lot of conservative pundits (who are, of course, on average wealthier, more urban, and more "elite" than the average American), there are "masses" - who have a deep, simple, but powerful wisdom when they like Bush, but are easily tricked by pretty boys like Anderson Cooper when they dislike Bush. In other words: not real people, but rather, props.

Wow, ya'll just never stop do you?

Mr. Bush, to me, appears guilty of one major fuckup in this whole fiasco... he acted like a buffoon yet again. A CAT 5 Hurricane is in the Gulf about to slam NOLA, the Weather Channel, CNN, and everyone else is saying "This is Very Bad... as in Lots of Death Bad" and Bush stayed on vacation. Other than that 'morale boost' difference, I doubt Kerry, Clinton, or any other president could have made a direct impact on the people who died.

NOLA should be directly responsible for the failures in NOLA. A city must be able to take care of itself. The mayor should have been screaming his head off to get money for those levees years ago. He should have been beating down the front door of the governors house, who should have been beating the State legislature to get money to protect the city.

The state of LA should be next in line for responsibility. The State needs to know what real threats there are in their state, they need to do risk assesments, they need to fund projects to reduce risk. They failed.

Finally, this disaster could just as easily have been accomplished with a few bits of plastic explosives on those levees. We could have had no days warning instead of two days warning and terrorists, not Katrina could have been responsible. The number of deaths would have been far more than they were, simply because no one would have gotten out. Yet, the federal government, who (we've been told) has been preparing for the next 9/11 since 2001, didn't respond in any fashion that would indicate that the past 3+ years of work has been beneficial.

NOLA shouldn't have been relying on the feds, but then this example seems to show me that none of us should be relying on the feds for disaster response. Like NOLA, we should be responsible for ourselves, our families and our communities, cause in the final tally, Bush/Kerry/Clinton/Regan/Frodo isn't gonna save your ass from drowning... either you swim or you sink, its your responsibility.

To the host:

BTW, firing the head of the organization at this point would be the worst way to handle the situation. As would voters instantaneously forcing out the mayor or the governor, if that were possible. If you do that, you add the problem of a bureaucratic transition to the already existing disaster recovery problems. Wait until the situation has stabilized, get a calm assessment of the facts, and then act. But calling for heads on a platter just makes the situation worse.

MJT, you've been had! You've been snowed and brainwashed by the MSM into thinking that saving people from a hurricane is primarily a function of the feds. It isn't. The feds function to clean up and rebuild afterwards; the "saving" plan is at the local and state level.

FEMA essentially had much of this mess dumped in their laps when L.A. and N.O. didn't implement their emergency plans. FEMA's response has been confused and that is partly Brown's fault, but at this stage, firing anyone other than a gibbering idiot would almost certainly make the confusion worse!

The most that can be said against Bush is that he did everything he could, but two days later than he should.

We don't always like the news we hear. That's tough. Don't give in to the MSM just to make the wolves stop baying.

THIS IS THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA!

HEARKEN UNTO ME, FOR I AM YOUR LORD!

I COMMAND YOU TO BELIEVE THINGS THAT ARE UNTRUE! I DO THIS IN THE NAME OF MY EVIL AGENDA!

FEW OF YOU REALIZE HOW POWERFUL I AM! ANY OPINIONS THAT ARE NOT IN LINE WITH CONSERVATIVE PUNDITRY AND TALKING POINTS ARE FALSE! IT IS INCONCEIVEALBE THAT A PERSON MIGHT COME TO THESE BELIEFS ON THEIR OWN AS A RESULT OF REASON OR CAREFUL THOUGHT!

VERILY, THE ONLY POSSIBLE EXPLANATION THAT SOMEONE MIGHT DISAGREE WITH - OR, PERISH THE THOUGHT, MINIONS - BE CRITICAL OF THE EVIL BUSH IS BECAUSE I, THE MSM, HAVE TRICKED THEM!

I HAVE SPOKEN!

One addendum to my earlier post.

One other issue that this administration and the news media must face, in my opinion, would be the disproportionate focus on a single threat. For three years we've dealt with Yellow Alerts and unspecified threats. Our people have been getting trained on how to deal with Anthrax and Dirty Bombs, but not dirty water and typhoid.

I do Risk Assesments on a weekly basis. We begin by looking at all potential threats (read Bad Things That Might Happen), we then take a look at the likelyhood of the threat actually occuring. Next we attach a dollar figure to the threat. At the end, we have a risk statement:

"Foo has a twenty-five percent chance of happening within the next 6 months, if foo happens, it will cost $2.5 million to recover."

Once we do this for all the threats we can identify, we prioritze them based on their likelyhood and cost. In my current mixed state of knowledge and ignorance, it would appear to me, that something bad got missed.

1. A Cat 4 or 5 hurricane hitting NOLA would appear more likely than a plane getting hijacked and rammed into another buidling. The sinking of NOLA would appear to have a higher cost (in lives, reconstruction, insurance and impact to our oil supply than another 9/11.

2. NOLA appears to have had a very vulnerable flaw, which could potentially have been exploited by our enemies with some explosives. The fact that money has been going to all sorts of half-baked 'threats', while a real one lies unfunded/underfunded, indicates a serious problem.

Again, Mary, not sure where you're coming from here. There's no homophobia involved - my "Bush-Fellatio Syndrome" can afflict men and women.

Did I mention fellatio in my last comment? This is your obesession, not mine. I also didn't mention BDS. I wouldn't blame your hysteria or your anger managment problems on Bush Derangement Syndrome because the cause and effect isn't clear. Many Bush-haters suffer from hysteria and anger management problems, but which came first, the chicken or the egg? Are they hysterical and enraged because they hate Bush or do they hate him because they already had a reflexive tendency to react to certain situations with fear and/or rage?

Tosk - as a Risk Management specialist, how would you advise people to cope with a possible emergency situation occuring in a town or city where a portion of the police (first responders) may literally be criminals?

Mary,

That is an excellent question, however, let me rrephrase it slightly to be more encompassing:

"[Who would you] advise people to [rely on in] a possible emergency situation occuring in a town or city where a portion of the police (first responders) may literally be criminals?"

My answer is the same people that they should rely on when the first responders are honest, hardworking folks... People need to rely on Themsleves. When disaster strikes you personally, the only person YOU KNOW FOR SURE that will be there is YOU. First Responders may be criminals, they may be cut off from getting to you, they may be helping someone else who is in greater danger. Every American should understand that government institutions can HELP us, but we cannot RELY on them to take care of us.

If you live in a city on the coast which is below the sea level, which is surrounded by water, which has levees that are rated for a CAT 3 Hurricane... then you had better have a plan for saving your own life. If you don't have a car, you'd better have a buddy system with people that do have cars. If you are poor, you should probably, at least, plan an exit route. If you live on the side of town where the water may climb to 20', then plan to get to the other side of town!

Personal Responsibility seems, to me, the first and only sure line of defense against disaster.

Earthquakes can come with no warning, even so there are things one can do to take personal responsibility for survival during a quake. House Fires may flare up within minutes, but planning ahead and taking personal responsibility can provide you with a greater chance of escaping (and saving your family). Hurricanes give you days of warning....

At the end of the day, I'm sure we'll find people to blame for these deaths. We'll blame the mayor, we'll blame the governor, we'll blame Bush. for some reason, Americans, once the champions of personal responsibility will forget to hand equal blame to the people who didn't attempt to plan for their own survival.

Ratatosk, Squirrel of Discord

Thanks, Tosk. I think I will go out and buy one of those emergency kits, something I've been putting off for a while, despite the fact that I live a mile from downtown New York - and in a flood zone.

Actually Tosk, I don't really hear the 'people' blaming anyone. Not really.

I hear my 'friends' in the media performing their usual stellar services and I hear the to be expected but nonetheless unseemly 'political' whining from the bankrupt permanent opposition, but the 'people' seem to be remarkably sanguine. Even those poor devils who had to live through the mess.

Maybe if the next disaster takes out the chattering classes first, we can get a better idea of the true character of the average person.
Oh how I wish.

Huh:

"In the event of a terrorist attack, natural disaster or other large-scale emergency, the Department of Homeland Security will assume primary responsibility on March 1st for ensuring that emergency response professionals are prepared for any situation. This will entail providing a coordinated, comprehensive federal response to any large-scale crisis and mounting a swift and effective recovery effort. The new Department will also prioritize the important issue of citizen preparedness. Educating America's families on how best to prepare their homes for a disaster and tips for citizens on how to respond in a crisis will be given special attention at DHS."

Commenter, and here we were gettin along so well.

Is your selected and selective quote not merely the usual bureaucratic crapola introducing a new agency? I very much doubt that little snipet supercedes the articles indicating that the Feds SUPPORT local authorites.

What is really needed as evidenced by the results is a temporary 'dictator' who has complete authority for the duration of the emergency. Sort of like ancient Rome and much like the role General Honore is performing as we speak but with more clout. As soon as the disaster is over, the individual steps down and things revert to the staqus quo.

Doug, I'm not even talking about a "dictator" who would magically take charge and make everything all right.

At this point, I'm asking: why wasn't food and water airdropped into the city? Why didn't they even do that?

Of course, there's lots more to be dealt with, but that pretty much sums it up. As I've said before, we could drop supplies to the Afghans, but not to Americans? In America? And people died, because they died from thirst? In America? When we knew the storm was coming? We thought it would be even worse than it was? There was no water to hand out?

At this point, I'm asking: why wasn't food and water airdropped into the city? Why didn't they even do that?--Commenter

As far as I know(big,big caveat)no-one died of thirst or starvation at the locations where it MIGHT have been possible to do as you ask. In fact, I happened to see a very short glimpse of a Vietnamese family sitting quietly in the Superdome waiting patiently for extraction, and this was on Friday. They were smiling at the camera.The problems seem to have been SECURITY related.

I too think more should have been done on this level but I will wait to see what really happened and what the conditions really were before running amok.

I think the 'dictator' idea has some merit. One overall command structure. One go-to guy for any problems. One stop shopping in a disaster situation. I bet something like that is adopted after all the smoke clears. I will also be surprised if the Armed Forces are not given the command role for future problems.

An old milk jug and some tapwater are probably available to even the most poor residents of the city. Yes, the authorities responded slowly... but not having even water, the most basic things one needs for survival is no one's fault but the person who died of thirst.

"I miss Bill Clinton something fierce in these moments."

Yeah. He could show us that can-do decisiveness and complete handle on matters that he displayed during the Waco incident.

Michael -

You're generally a pretty level-headed guy, but I'm going to have to take you to task on this one. You seem to be among the crowd that believes in this magical being called "The Government".

Quick hint: there's no such thing as "The Government".

It's just a word - a word that describes an idea, in the same way the word "nations" describes a human mental construct, not objective reality. And generally, our little human constructs - whether they be mental, like "nations", or physical, like "roads" - do a tremendous job of adhering to the purposes for which they were constructed...the idea of "nations" keeps the world humming along relatively smoothly, just as the "roads" of our nation keep us fed and employed and comfortable.

The problem, however, arises when someone - or something - doesn't play by the mental and societal rules that we've set up. In the 1930's, the people who grossly underestimated Hitler's actions and intentions weren't stupid people, nor were they evil. They were for the most part good, sincere people who simply could not fathom that someone would want to "rock the societal boat" in the fashion that Hitler did. They listened to his "grievances" and took him at his word when he promised that he only wanted this small piece of land or that small concession. IOW, they refused to see the objective reality that was staring them in the face because of their desire to hold onto the subjective reality that they were comfortable with. In the interest of coming together as a nation, I'll refrain from making comparisons to those of a certain political persuasion in today's world :)

And exactly the same thing is going on right now. Objective reality - in the form of Katrina - has overwhelmed our subjective reality...and it's done so like a muthaf#@ker.

"The Government" is actually a huge collection of separate, disparate entities handling various aspects of the day-to-day activities that allow a civilized society to function. And they are only able to operate properly because the system - for the most part - operates the way we want it to...day-after-day. But when you throw the smallest kink into the equation - a computer virus, power outage, snow storm - many of these entities are brought to grinding halt.

Tell us, Michael: where on your "kink-in-the-system-meter" does hundreds of thousands of people standing on the roofs of there houses...swimming for lives...left homeless and without food or supplies across the STATES of Louisana and Mississippi reqister?

The simple fact of the matter is that there is NO SUCH THING as preparing for something like this. And once something like this happens, there is NO SUCH THING as "handling it well" in the intial days that follow the event. This is being called the worst natural disaster in the history of this country. If something like this were easy to manage, then it would be called something other than "disaster", eh?

The purpose of an agency like FEMA is not to make everything OK for everybody everywhere in a manner of days. Its purpose is to REASONABLY and EFFECTIVELY manage the overall societal effects that occur in such an emergency. That can only be accomplished over an extended period of time, not a matter of days.

IOW, Michael Brown's job description can be summed up thusly: do the best that you can reasonably do when a completely f#@ked up, sh!#ty natural disaster occurs that destroys more property than the Asian tsunami and dwarfs the destruction of 9/11...and do it in a way that satisfies all Americans...all us soft, pampered, sheltered Americans.

Anyone want an application?

PS - I heard that Bush had to basically strong arm the Louisiana governor and New Orleans mayor into issuing the evacuation orders that went out that Saturday...an order that got nearly 400,000 people out of New Orleans alone. D'ya think that maybe - just maybe - Michael Brown had anything to do with that?

I am reminded that 9 years ago yesterday, Hurricane Fran (one of the costliest US hurricanes) hit NC and came as far inland into the NC "Triangle" (Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill) where I live.

It's interesting that in situations like that - it is your most precious natural resources that turn into the bane of your existence. In coastal and river areas that means water. Where we live, that means trees - trees on vehicles, trees on houses, trees across roads, trees down on power lines, tree debris everywhere, like parsley dropped into a blender and then spewed out with the lid off and the blender still turning. No power (or phones) and (for those of us with well water) no water for a week. Then in Dec 2002, a massive ice storm coated the trees and the next day stepping outside meant taking your life in your hands as branches and trees came crashing down everywhere in the eerie silence. Again - no power and no water (for us with wells) for almost a week in freezing temperatures. Some people died because they started generators INSIDE their homes. You should see NC before a storm warning now! The last loaf of bread is gone from the stores. Everyone knows how to use a chainsaw. Everyone with well water knows to fill their bathtubs and every last receptacle in the house with water when a storm warning is issued Most of all, though, everyone knows how to help everyone else get through it.

(I had never even heard of FEMA when Fran struck in 96. It was created in 1979 but pre-9/11 I was a little slow to catch on to these things:-))

Words of wisdom to those living in flood plains - Put an axe in your attic RIGHT NOW. I saw a 90 year old woman on TV just pulled out of her home in NO yesterday, calm as could be! - she had survived in her attic for a week (it must have dawned on her to stock some food and water up there although apparently she didn't have an axe). She just asked for a cold drink and said that the gatorade the rescuers gave her was terrific!

Tosk is right. It is up to each of us to understand the peculiar dangers represented by our unique environments, to prepare for those as best we can, and to be active locally to understand the emergency procedures in place for our local communities and the holes in those procedures. It may take FEMA 72 hours to come to our rescue. That's reality. Frankly - if that's the lesson we all take away from Katrina, then it will be a valuable wake-up call for all of us.

"An old milk jug and some tapwater are probably available to even the most poor residents of the city. Yes, the authorities responded slowly... but not having even water, the most basic things one needs for survival is no one's fault but the person who died of thirst."

Even your house is completely under water? Even if you are locked in the Superdome?

The idea that Bush "strongarmed" anyone into issuing an evacuation order has been thoroughly debunked. The Washington Post even issued a retraction. Blanco declared a state of emergency on Friday. Good timeline here - http://talkingpointsmemo.com/katrina-timeline.php

The extent to which Bush's actions can actually be held responsible for the results of the Hurricane is certainly debatable. What is very clear however is that Bush did not take the hurricane seriously until Tuesday or even Wednesday. If you sincerely feel that this was a local matter than Bush's inattention shouldn't bother you at all, so why are so many people simultaneously attacking the locals for not doing their jobs while claiming Bush was actually trying to lead the process?

Sivert: "Even your house is completely under water?"

You stick the water jugs at the highest point of your house if you live in a flood plain. And also, if you live in a neighborhood where crime is a problem on an average day, you learn how to use a gun and you keep one in your house.

Right-Wingers would rather be sucking Bush off, but defending him is the next best thing?

(i knew it)

Uh, "dude", you occasionally make some good points. Don't get yourself banned for something stupid like this.

.

.

.

for the people who think im a bush-hater, let me make one thing perfectly clear, i dont hate our president.

allow me to explain.

i love pot.

marijuana, mary jane, cheeba, weed, chronic

green sticky purple haired wacky tobbacky.

love it.

i love the smell, i love the taste, i love its looks,

i love the culture, i love the sharing, i love people who smoke it, i love its resin, i love its paraphenalia, i love its high.

i love smelling pot in the bag, i love packing it into a bowl, i love lighting it, i love the sound that the water makes as it gurgles as i take a rip, i love inhaling, i love exhaling

i love exhaling it into the mouth of a pretty girl and i love to watch her close her eyes as she holds it

i love the sound of one holding and failing slightly - gnk - cough - gnk.

i love laughing and laughing and laughing at laughing.

i love hotboxing, i love rolling joints, i love finding weed, i love being passed joints, i love songs about weed, i love references about weed, i love the variety of uses for weed/hemp, i love the many ways to call weed weed. i love looking at the clock and noticing when it says 4:20.

got it?

k.

but at some point i had to really look at pot and what it was doing to me and i had to make the adult decision that it was hurting me more than it was helping me, it was costing me money without giving me much of a high any more, and it was slowly and surely killing me and putting me in danger.

so i acted like a grown up and quit.

i saw it was bad for me, i stoped, and in no way does that make me a hater.

similarily i ask you to look at your relationship, bush supporters, to this president, and ask yourself the same thing

is this president the leader that you expect from the most powerful man in america. is he causing you more headaches than joy. is he as effective as he should be considering the fact that he has a republican congress and a republican supreme court and support from most of the media for the exception of the nyt, the wapo, and for a few hours a day cbs?

are you truly in support of this president's actions or have you just gotten into a habit of supporting republicans no matter what theyre doing to your well-being?

you can love bush like i love weed but ask yourself what it will take for you to kick the habit.

it took me 5 years of smoking and not getting high for me to realize that i was just going through the motions of smoking without receiving that euphoria, that benefit, that kick.

has george bush given you what you expect from the president's office since 9/11 or have you just let him off the hook year after year after year?

i was not in the biggest defict of my life because of weed, i was not vilified by the world because of my habit, i am in good health and i was in good health, but at some point i took a long look at what i was doing and i made the conscious decision to stop it.

i kicked the habit.

i invite you to kick this habit of voting republican and supporting whoever does whatever regardless of what they do, because it is simply a habit which perhaps once was useful, but the thrill is gone.

america its time to get off the pipe.

http://www.tonypierce.com/blog/bloggy.htm

I can only imagine how all of you would be reacting if this had happened under President Kerry.

You know, the guy that Bush said would be worse at protecting us from, you know, threats?

You people are pathetic.

In general, disaster planning starts at the lowest level and works up to the top. In New orleans, the city had the primary responsibility for ensuring an orderly evacuation. That had to be co-ordinated with the state. The feds role is to roll in 72-96 hours after the fact and provide whatever resources are required.

New Orleans had an emergency evacuation plan. They'd also had a dress rehearsal a year ago when Ivan threatened the city. That evacuation went about as well as it did for Katrina - the poor, elderly and sick were left behind. In other words, the city did not update and improve its emergency evacuation plan from 2004. How else to explain why so many school buses were abandoned to flooding? They were supposed to be used in any mass evacuation. Admittedly, as jIM mILLER notes, there was, at most, 48 hours available. The mayor and the governor, despite the urging of Bush, wasted 24 of those valuable hours.

The good news is the city got a lot of people out. The bad news is, not enough. Houston's Astrodome was stocked and prepared as an emergency refuge in case Galveston got hit again (7000 died there in a 1900 hurricane). The Superdome was not so prepared, yet a previous attempt to evacuate people there had been as poorly implemented as the present one.

So, a lot of blame rests with the city itself, and its mayor.

The governor is in charge of the Louisiana National Guard. She is their Commander-in-Chief. She can call on other states and get their National Guards to assist. With the other governor's faxed permission, she can use them for policing duties as well as general relief. If the President orders in the National Guard they are prevented, by law, from doing any police work. They could not arrest looters, guard buildings and so forth. The Governor did not allow the Louisians National Guard into the city because "Blanco's advisers told her that the remaining 7,000 National Guard troops left in Louisiana were not enough to secure the city of New Orleans, and that it was not in her best political interest to use them until they could be reinforced since they might get hurt, or worse, hurt or kill a civilian they were charged with protecting." (Link

So looting, over and beyond food and drink, was rampant. The cops joined in and guns were among the first things to get looted. A shoot-to-kill looters order would have made the city safe enough to send in the Red Cross, for example.

The Governor appeared to have kept the mayor out of the loop. As of today, they were still unable to agree whether or not the city should be completely evacuated.

I'm going to agree that FEMA's performance was inadequate, if your sources are correct. Cherry-picking a few bad reports and ignoring any successes is not fair criticsm.

The city and state failed in the first three days of their responsibilities. As first responders, they failed to live up to their responsibilities.

It also appears that real progress started happening only when the US military moved in in force.

While everyone is focussed on New Orleans, we are forgetting that Mississippi bore the full brunt of Katrina's category 4 land fall; the results were total desruction along the coast and miles inland. Yet, that state seems to have managed the carastrophe rather better than Louisiana.

Because about 98% of the problem was the idiot state and local government's fault

Update: Red Cross Says "We Were Kept From Superdome By State"

September 7, 2005 7:01 p.m. EST

Douglas Maher - All Headline News Staff Reporter

Washington, D.C. (AHN) - A report on Fox News from correspondent Major Garrett Wednesday night reveals a major break into what exactly went wrong at the Louisiana Superdome in the days after Hurricane Katrina struck the city.

An American Red Cross representative tells Fox News that the Louisiana State Homeland Security Department refused the relief organization permission to take food and water to the Superdome because they did not want to "encourage people to go there."

They State office of Homeland Security wanted to get people out and were afraid that providing support would be a "magnet" attracting more displaced citizens of New Orleans.

Stay with All Headline News for more on this developing aspect of the Hurricane Katrina Relief.

http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/70000606

I, too, thought "poopy face" was offered to Commenter to reduce his otherwise deliberately offensive potty mouth.

As I've mentioned in disagreement with Jeff Jarvis of F* speech in radio, I think acceptance of extreme obscenity in conversation leads to more polarization and even more x-hate, of whatever x the potty mouth hates.

Funny how few Bush-bashers are willing to commit themselves to writing, in a timeline fashion, what Actions/ orders they think Bush should have done. And when.

Tosk, thanks so much for having some good notes on blame passing. But there's a Long established Leftist attitude that all poor are "victims", and therefore not responsible for themselves -- with the expected result of them acting irresponsible.

The Dems generally offer more "victim" status, and freedom FROM responsibility, to as many groups as they can.

Other reports indicate the cops/ guards were lying to residents at various times in the lousy evacuation/ rescue efforts.

Firing Brown, now, would more likely allow a "dictator" into FEMA to get things done, and shake up the bureaucracy. If Bush waits even a month, as is likely, any shake-up will morph into merely a commission/ committee planned & approved CYA re-organization.

Brown should be fired.

Then, Blanco and Nagin should RESIGN.

Let's see if anyone on the left will agree with this.

My guess is not. They will somehow find enough compassion in their hearts to let Blanco and Nagin off the hook.

(all along saying, 'don't gte me wrong the locals screwed up too')

Excellent, Pat, excellent!!

Micheal, have you even bothered to read what the Red Cross has to say about getting into NO?

Access to New Orleans is controlled by the National Guard and local authorities and while we are in constant contact with them, we simply cannot enter New Orleans against their orders.

Is it not possible that FEMA (Red Cross is part of the FEMA response) was on the ball but not getting cooperation from the local officials, sovereigns of the land. Here are the lists of disasters in 2003, 2004 and 2005. Brown was appointed in January of 2003, his record speaks for itself. As do the records of the corrupt and incompetent officials of Louisiana.

You owe Under Secretary Brown an apology Michael. I doubt that you have the integrity to pay that debt, given that you didn't even have the decency to acquaint yourself with the facts before posting this drivel. You have now become Andrew Sullivan.

I have to go along with Tosk on this - I was raised in the mountains of New Mexico where I learned early on that I needed to take care of myself - I understood that the government wasn't going to do squat for me if there was trouble. Where are the comments about personal responsibility? I have been helping out with the storm victims who are here in Houston - everyone should be given a second chance for making a bad decision and many of these people did make a bad decision. They chose to stay on the coast at or below sea level when a category 4/5 hurricane was heading right for them. Darwin at work I guess. Some who decided to stay payed the ultimate price. Unfortunate, but there was ample warning. When did Americans become so completely dependent on the government to help them out in time of a crisis? Strange.

ebony ivory together @ ebony ivory woman @ ebony ivory xxx @ ebony j lavacom pussy @ ebony jet magazine @ ebony joy @ ebony joy movie @ ebony joy sample @ ebony joy sample clip @ ebony joy sample movie @ ebony joy sample video @ ebony jug @ ebony juicy booty @ ebony knight @ ebony knight sex @ ebony knight xxx @ ebony lady @ ebony lady foot @ ebony lady naked @ ebony lady nude @ ebony lady of wrestling @ ebony lady thick @ ebony lady trany @ ebony leg muscle @ ebony leg pic woman @ ebony leg sex @ ebony legged sexy woman @ ebony lesbian @ ebony lesbian ass @ ebony lesbian clip @ ebony lesbian eating pussy @ ebony lesbian free movie @ ebony lesbian fucking @ ebony lesbian gallery @ ebony lesbian girl @ ebony lesbian group @ ebony lesbian hardcore @ ebony lesbian kissing @ ebony lesbian licking @ ebony lesbian licking pussy @ ebony lesbian movie @ ebony lesbian movie clip @ ebony lesbian movie gallery @ ebony lesbian mpeg @ ebony lesbian nude @ ebony lesbian orgy @ ebony lesbian photo @ ebony lesbian pic @ ebony lesbian picture @ ebony lesbian porn

FOOLS!

Those firemen were used for photo-ops!

All that crap that FEMA gave them was to keep them busy, until they could take staged photos with Bush and other admin. folks!

The idea that Bush "strongarmed" anyone into issuing an evacuation order has been thoroughly debunked.

Actually, no...it hasn't.

The Washington Post retraction that you're talking about is a correction regarding when Governor Blanco declared a state of emergency, which was Friday, 9/26. The mandatory evacuation order was given on Sunday, 09/28 at 10am...after a telephone call from President Bush.

Declaring a state of emergency is not the same thing as ordering a mandatory evacuation.

None of which matters anyway in the context in which I posited it. The overriding question is who's to blame? The answer: everyone. Pres. Bush could have done things better, Governor Blanco could have done things better, Mayor Nagin could have done things better, Michael Brown could have done things better, the people of NO could have done things better, and on and on and on.

The problem I have with all of this is that immediate focus of blame was directed squarely at President Bush, with nary a mention of the CATASTROPHIC FAILURES of the Democrat-run governments of both Louisiana and New Orleans, governments who should have been planning for this sort of eventuality for the past 100 years. And while there are certainly things to criticize Michael Brown about, my sincere believe is that for many on the Left, the criticism is actually just another backhanded attempt to once again attack Pres. Bush. The political spinning of this is truly disgusting.

As I've said before, the Democratic party needs to split, with the Kos leftists going their way and the Lieberman moderates going the other. Then those of us in the political middle - the TRUE MAJORITY - can have more than a devil's choice between voting for either a party that is enslaved to the Socialist Left and or that is enslaved to Religious Right.

Sivert,

"An old milk jug and some tapwater are probably available to even the most poor residents of the city. Yes, the authorities responded slowly... but not having even water, the most basic things one needs for survival is no one's fault but the person who died of thirst."

Even your house is completely under water? Even if you are locked in the Superdome?

No, you get a jug of water when the Weather station tells you that a Cat 4/5 Hurricane will be knocking on your door in 48 hours. Even in a wheelchair, one should be able to get a jug/bottle/container of some sort and get it over to a sink where one can put water in said container. There was no excuse for the thousands who were lined up in front of the Dome for hours, their arms full of clothes, toys and at least one person with a television, to have had no water.

Think about it, one can survive without a change of clothes, one can survive without blankets (esp in NOLA in the summer), one can even survive for a while without food (and perhaps without TV). However, one cannot survive for long without water. Water should be a humans instinctive 'first choice' of things in an emergency. After that comes food, or clothing/blankets if its really cold. Then, perhaps some means of protecting oneself, not necessarily a gun (though probably useful), but even a knife, a stick, or some training in personal defense.

None of that stuff WILL save your life, it will only increase the likelyhood of survival. But, that is all anyone can do.

I find it unbelievable that so many forget 8th grade history lessons.

To Blame the President is silly. To blame FEMA for not doing enough may be justified, but one needs to really examine FEMA's role. They are a FEDERAL Agency. Not a State Agency. They "clean-up" the mess.

As our 8th grade history lessons will tell us, the President is POWERLESS when it comes to intervening in the affairs of INDIVIDUAL STATES.

Mayor Nagin said that both he and Governor Blanco had a "1 hour meeting with the President aboard Air Force One." Nagin said that "President Bush offered the Governor two choices." Furthermore Mayor Nagin said that Governor Blanco needed 24 hours to decide "what do do."

Before you start on FEMA and cite thousands of uncorroborated "stories," stick to what is known..

The Governor hesitated. It cost lives. Did FEMA move too slowly, probably... But what the Governor did was INEXCUSIBLE. Her inability to make a decision delayed FEMA's response. She bears full responsibility for "getting the clean-up ball rolling..."

That is simply unforgivable.

It would be wise to direct the rage at those responsible and not by political desires..

Unfortunatley, I don't have time to read all 100 and something comments to see if this has been linked to, so I'll assume it hasn't (and forgive me if I'm repeating myself).

http://wuzzadem.typepad.com/wuz/2005/09/another_katrina_1.html

Another Katrina Myth: Homeland Security Wouldn't Let Red Cross Deliver Food and Water to Katrina Victims

Read it. This is a clear example of rushing to judgement. This, I think, falls under the same heading as "Iraq is going to a mess!" that seems to pop up every few days. Eh.

orgeio aithousa anamonin @ binteo astunomikon charistikon @ kano mpanio pateroylen @ binteo choeytria eikonidio @ sex latex eikonidio @ klipaki paraxenon @ pio kryo noikokura @ password xyrisma tainia @ picture trichoton charistikon @ mechanobion omorphotere @ free koykla photo @ pic ephebon eleytheron @ password erasitechnen eikonidia @ to pio kryo chysia @ picture paichnidiaren kinematographon @ pics epideixian tainia @ trelon uperbaron @ athoon tainia @ semantikon poutana @ prote sunaisthematikon @ aphentiko me demena matia @ aoraton me stithon @ na chezo mama @ download pepeiramenon eleytheron @ zesto epicheirese @ apaision bretanon @ picture amathematismeno eleytheron @ prote sto diamerisma @ pic magazi eleytheron @ komikon ephebon @ pio kauto eikonen @ porno pozarontas tainia @ kauto moro @ gamisou teleion @ binteos mpanio tainia @ thrasyn koilia @ kano mpanio prosenin @ zigkolo pateran @ binteos gkeisa klima @ pic kounelaki eikonidio @ sex epideixian photographia @ orimon omorphon @ password tsechon binteo @ porno buzia eikona @ avi prosopo klipakia @ orgasmon sten kouzina @ dagkomatia pics @ pics ephebon eleytheron @ asiaten sta skalia @ kolpon picture

You FOOLS! All of you - Micheal, your thoughtful, smarty, snippy and reactionary readers alike have all been DUPED!!

This is all the fault of: Darth Rove of course!
(he was elevated to Dark Lord of the Sith after conjuring the Plame and then have it dissapparate before it disrupted his next feeding).

OK, seriously now.

I think we should wait on FEMA reform until we've heard the whole story. I ain't talkin' 'bout any constipation committee from Congress, I'm referring to officials from MS, TX, AL and FL who are also and still dealing with FEMA. I think the trouble will be found mostly in Louisiana....

Ric said
> amazing thing about it is that there are still people who think
turning control over to bureaucracies is a wonderful thing Lots of Death Bad" and Bush stayed on vacation

votzenbilder-ficken-fotze latex-dildo hustler-taboo rasierte verkauf-pornofilme pervers schwanzlutscher-muschi-sofort sexdvd votz dildo-movie comm-geile-votzen hustler-white b-58-hustler online-sexshop gay-dvd sexshop-dvd hustler-t-shirt rammeln uebergrosse-geile-votzen anpissen-votze dildo-online livesex fotzenbilder-geile-votzen fuking hardcore-shop moesensaft-muschi hardcorevideo hotpussy onanie adult-magazine notgeile ebony-hustler ggg-video wichsvorlagen pornofilme-edonkey pornofilme-gebraucht scary-dildo titen strap-on-dildo dildo-games lippen-muschi dildo-versand pornogirls hardcore-dildo hustler-dj-groupie pisse password-hustler dildo-bestellen hustler-zeitschrift pornofilme-archiv pornofilme-cover scary-dildo-movies dildo-arsch hustler-portman sex-dildo sexsuchmaschinen dildo-bike kostenfreie-pornofilme geile-ficken-fotze hustler-magazine rosette smoothe-da-hustler hustler-barley-legal lange-kitzler the-hustler giant-dildo ihren-votze-live wichse pornofilme-verzeichnis taboo-hustler magazin-hustler mund-muschi dildo-gratis sexvideos porno-dildo gesichtsbesamung dildo-aufblasbar sexseiten-muschi-sofort vibrator-dildo dildo-vibrator gepierct-teen-muschi dildo-girls dildo-hardcore dildo-bilder dildo-anal scheissen-muschi-sofort praline-hustler pornofotos fotzenschleim-muschi dildo-mpegs dildo-gay arschlecken www-dildo unzensiert-votze-live fotogalerien dildo-video pussy-dildo genitalien abspritzen-ficken-fotze dildo-fucking hustler-nl hustler-videos meinen-kitzler fick hustler-dj geil-muschi-sofort dildo-mpeg abnormale-muschi dildo-jpg dildo-fuck sexphotos strapon-dildo pornovideos heisse-girls gratisporno pornofilme-muschi-sofort xxx-dildo teen-dildo faustfick-votze-live willige-girls hustler-deutschland hustler-campus-confessions dildo-porno hustler-house-geile-enge-votzen moepse dildo-in-pussy hustler-doll orgasmus gefickt dildo-shop versaut-votze-live dildo-sex dildo-im-arsch geschlechtsteile sexrekorde hustler-young-sluts pornofilme-charts beischlaf-ficken-fotze pornofilme-zum-herunterladen portman-hustler www-dildo-de extremsex gay-video-shop hustler-gallery penise tussis dildo-teens gratis-pornofilme-downloaden divx-pornofilme-download hustler-video studentinnen extrem-dildo video-post-dildo wahre-liebe hustler-galleries dildo-pussy umschnall-dildo feuchte-teens geschlechtsverkehr kontaktanzeigen dildo-gallery pornofilme-bewertung top-10-pornofilme anal-dildo dildo-spiele erotik-video-versand gay-dildo liste-pornofilme dildo-cam fette-votze-live ihren-kitzler hustler-pics nacktfotos b58-hustler-geile-enge-votzen nackte-votze-live extreme-dildo pornofilme-verleih reife-ficken-fotze hardcore-filme hustler-girls hustler's erotikvideos hustler-com pornofile arschloch hustler-dvd gruppensex hustler-virtual-girl hustler-xxx sexmagazine double-dildo dildo-tgp analsex mok-neukoelln-hustler pornofilme-online-shop omasex-muschi erotikseiten hustler-party riesen-dildo fotzenbilder aersche-ficken-fotze grosse-kitzler hustler-erotik gruppensex-muschi-sofort hustler-password grosse-kitzler brueste dildo-insertion huge-dildo hustler-romania hustler-fotos erotikfilm erotikfotos pornovideo dildos sexfilme nacktbilder shop-dildo dildo-galleries res-the-hustler brustwarze-ficken-fotze hussler erotik-dvd-shop hustler-jpg hustler-us dildo-story schlecken-muschi der-kitzler dildo-slip dildo-pictures lesbensex muschibilder kacken dildo-kaufen kaviar feuchte-ficken-fotze erotischer kitzler muschis dildo-pics streicheln-muschi kitzler-lecken pornobilder-ficken-fotze lesbian-dildo fingern masturbieren dildo-de sextoys dildo heisse-nasse-votze amateurporno vibrator-in-votze dildo-movies big-dildo samenerguss dvd-sex-shop dildo-mpg husler-geile-votzen dildo-lesbian pimmel-geile-votzen g-punkt dildo-pic kacke-geile-votzen glass-dildo dildo-teen dildo-forum gratis-dildo dildo-avi dildo-action knackige-geile-votzen dildo-babes rasiert-geile-votzen pimel dildo-machine dildo-com lesben-dildo dildo-ass

MJT, you've been had!...firing anyone other than a gibbering idiot would almost certainly make the confusion worse!

Well, well, well, Brown did resign after all. My apologies, MJT.

Of course, Bush claims he didn't know until the MSM told him. That sounds worthy of "gibbering idiot" status, doesn't it?

Hi I have been given the task of getting links for our websites thathave good page rank on the links directories.In addition we have many categories so your site will be place on an appropriate page. If you would like to trade links please send me your website details.Best Regards,seopro@walla.com
http://www2w.bravehost.com vs the best casino http://casino.vmedical.us new online casino
casinos
casino
online poker
online gambling
online casinos
online casinos
online casinos
online poker
online casinos
online casino
casino
poker
casino
casino
casinos
online casino
online gambling
casino
poker
neteller casinos
online casino
online poker
online casino
internet poker
free online poker
texas holdem poker
poker
online slots
online roulette
online blackjack
poker
online casinos
online casino
online casino
online roulette
online poker
internet casinos
online slots
online blackjack

online poker
online casino
online viagra sale
try viagra online
order viagra online
buy viagra online
order cialis online
free levitra online
cheap meridia online
buy xenical online
order propecia
order viagra online
online casino
online slots
phentermine
phentermine
levitra
tami flu
online poker
poker
poker
online poker
online poker
poker
poker

super promocje odzież dziecięca , niezłe atrakcje u-booty, dvd odtwarzacze dvd, roboty kuchenne sa fajne Roboty kuchene , filmy dvd sklep super nowsci dvd, prawo lex Radca prawny , sklep internetowy ekspresy do kawy , golarki i inne depilujące urządzenia Golarki , odkurzacze do odkurzania odkurzacze, żelazka do prasowania i wygładzania materiałów ubraniowch :) żelazka, telewizory lcd okno na świat Telewizory lcd, a tu telewizory plazmowe o jeszcze coś fajnego Telewizory plazmowe , kamery cyfrowe kamery cyfrowe super promo najlepszych firm firmowanych w firmie firmowo firmowej :))).

Kamery cyfrowe bleble takie sobie me Wózki dziecięce Kancelaria prawna to i owo Telewizory lcd ale w kolo jhest wesolo notebooki mamy takie o to teges sony a nie tegos samsung

puz, sl, zdrowa żywność, mieszkania Warszawa, ogłoszenia nieruchomości, projektowanie stron, tworzenie stron, agencja reklamowa, reklama w internecie, psycholog, nauka angielskiego, soczewki kontaktowe, psyche sf, jk, nls, projektowanie wnętrz, hydraulik Warszawa, opcataloz, domy opieki, freetimes, jidds, fabrykapoe, sfworks, polskepoeje, pb, pp, jk, wypadki, opony, agroturystyka, klimatyzacja, apteka, dentysta, f, kray, ewes, angs, git, akupunktura, sc

Nowadays, shopping for adult products has never been easier at a sex toy shop. Today you can browse through thousands of adult items: form lingerie, dildos, vibrators to sex toys, comparing each characteristics, prices and looking for the best choice for you. But is it really easy now to find exactly what you are looking for, receive it discretely and in a timely manner? Hence, we would like to offer you some helpful tips on adult products online shopping.

Sex Toys

sex toys

Penis Extension

Vibrators

waterproof vibrators

sex toys vibrators

Strap on dildos

dildos

huge dildos

Rabbit Vibrators

lovedolls

realistic dildos

realistic vaginas

anus

Penis Pumps

Cock Rings

Blowjob

1. Start from the general information within the product category. Let’s say you are looking for vibrating dildos or vibrators. It is easy to be lost – so many different types, colors, styles and prices! However, you can find some educational sites as well as web forums on this subject. You can also explore all the different kinds of dildos and vibrators, including their functions, as well as feedback from other people who bought it. A piece of advice from somebody with a personal experience might help you to decide what exactly will be great for your pleasure.

Masturbators

anal sex toys

butt plugs

Sex Games

Lubrication

condoms

Once you decided on a product, go ahead and browse through online “shelves”. There are so many online adult toy stores that sell dildos, vibrators as well as other sex toys on the web. Here is a tip – choose ones that have a nice and clean layout, a lot of info on each product and good pictures so you can see it in details. In the real world you would definitely prefer to shop in a clean and friendly atmosphere, why would you change your preferences? Don’t be shy to ask questions about the dildos and vibrators you want to buy – send it to them via e-mail. Here you don’t have to deal with a rude sales person making silly jokes about your choice…

Bondage sex toys

Kits

edible undies

gags

cockring

strapons

nipple suckers

vibrating massagers

vaginas

sex dolls

male sex dolls

shemale sex dolls

sex swings

anal beads

Ejaculating butt Plug

love swing

sex swing

adult games

condoms

panties

Before placing your order go back to search engines and enter the exact name of the dildos and vibrators you are going to buy. You’ll be surprised – some stores might have the same items for less! Not talking about free shipping, spring sale and many other offers that they might have for you… so don’t hurry, shop around!

mens underwear

Erotic Lingerie

Sexy lingerie is provocative, attractive and extremely appealing to the senses, especially for men. Men get turned on very easily by anything that is visually stimulating. Erotic Lingerie if chosen and worn correctly can titillate the senses and drive your partner wild! So, sexy lingerie is a sure way to get your partner fired up and coming back for more.

erotic lingerie

sexy lingerie

babydolls

bustiers

corsets

camisoles

chainmail

chemises

mini dresses

French maid costume

garter belts

lace lingerie

panties

teddies

video on demand

porn videos

Rent Adult DVDs

adult dvd rentals

adult dvd rentals online

rent adult dvds

buy adult dvds

adult dvds

latex clothing

Latex Mini Skirt

Latex Mini dress

body paints

Dildos

mini vibrator

g-spot

butterfly vibrator

double dong

Clitoral Stimulator

Infrared Massager

Rabbit Vibrator

Penis Pump

Cuffs

anal beads

Jenna Jameson dvd

Strap On dildo

butt plug

clit stimulator

Sex Toys

Sex Toys can be very useful especially when your partner is out of town.
· Sex Toys can also be a good option when you want to spice up your relationship.

Rage of Vibrators

Both men and women are in need of sexual release. A vibrator or vibrating toy can help you orgasm faster and facilitate human sexual pleasure. Vibrators are considered to be the most popular forms of all sex toys available today. Vibrators are considered as favorites among the women and have become very popular over the years. Vibrators are available in different variations and models and any couple can find it as per their needs. Apart from vibrators there are many other types of sex toys that can add spice in your sexual relationship. The two major types of sex toys are

Butterfly vibrator

jack rabbit vibrator

Clitoral Vibrator

rabbit pearl Vibrator

rabbit Vibrator

Vibrating Pussy

rabbit vibrator

clit vibrator

sex toy

sex toys

runescape money runescape gold runescape money runescape gold wow power leveling wow powerleveling Warcraft Power Leveling Warcraft PowerLeveling buy runescape gold buy runescape money runescape items runescape gold runescape money runescape accounts runescape gp dofus kamas buy dofus kamas Guild Wars Gold buy Guild Wars Gold lotro gold buy lotro gold lotro gold buy lotro gold lotro gold buy lotro gold runescape money runescape power leveling runescape money runescape gold dofus kamas cheap runescape money cheap runescape gold Hellgate Palladium Hellgate London Palladium Hellgate money Tabula Rasa gold tabula rasa money lotro gold buy lotro gold Tabula Rasa Credit Tabula Rasa Credits Hellgate gold Hellgate London gold dofus kamas buy dofus kamas 血管瘤 肝血管瘤 音乐剧 北京富码电视 富码电视 富码电视台 7天酒店 7天连锁酒店 7天连锁 自清洗过滤器 过滤器 压力开关 压力传感器 流量开关 流量计 液位计 液位开关 温湿度记录仪 风速仪 可燃气体检测仪 wow power leveling wow powerleveling Warcraft PowerLeveling Warcraft Power Leveling World of Warcraft PowerLeveling World of Warcraft Power Leveling runescape power leveling runescape powerleveling
runescape money runescape gold wow power leveling 棕榈树
eve isk
eve online isk
eve isk
eve online isk