October 29, 2003

A Snake that Eats its Own Tail

Zeyad, an Iraqi dentist blogging from Baghdad, on the recent suicide bombings:

Suicide attacks are carried out by you-know-who. This is Bin Ladens gift to his fellow Iraqi Muslims. Didn't he say it himself a while ago? I demand that all Iraqi diplomatic relations with Saudi Arabia and Syria cease immediately. I demand that we expel all foreign Arabs from Iraq until further notice. A little firmness is necessary. We can't just sit and wait for the next attacks. Iraq should resign from the Arab League which is just a symposium for dictators. Who the hell needs it anymore? They didn't even officially show sympathy for Iraqis after the attacks. They should be considered the enemy unless they act promptly to secure their borders and ensure that no Mujahedeen sneak through to Iraq daily. They are the ones to blame. We all know they have an interest in keeping up the attacks and the chaos. They are aware of the fact that they are next on the list after Saddam. They will pursue every possible effort to make the Iraqi example fail. When attacks are carried out in other Arab countries they consider it terrorism, but in Iraq it is resistance against the occupying Americans.
From an earlier post last week:
Someone has been writing graffiti all over Baghdad threatening to kill children who accept the new schoolbags that are to be gifted to them by UNESCO for the new school season. Also warning that any hand waving to the infidel Americans will be cut.

Are these people sane? I mean what are they thinking? Is this our latest form of 'resistance'? Threatening our own children for getting some shiny new schoolbags. I am trying very hard to understand. This so called resistance is getting hated more and more by Iraqis everywhere. I'm sure this will only add to that scorn exponentially. They are losing any sympathy they may have had earlier. The terrorists have turned out to be MUCH dumber than I thought.

I am not a religious person. I don't believe in any tangible thing called Evil, at least not in the Satanic or Biblical sense.

That aside, there is no better word to describe the thugs who are wreaking destruction in Baghdad. They are evil. I'm also with Zeyad on this. They're dumb. They're made blindingly stupid by their own evil. Utterly incapable of winning popular support, they thrash about violently consuming themselves and others around them. It is no way to win a popularity contest. If we faced a genuinely popular insurgency in Iraq, we'd have one hell of a serious problem. But this crowd is the absolute scum of the earth, and most Iraqis know it. If we don't run away, they are not going to win.

Posted by Michael J. Totten at October 29, 2003 12:15 AM
Comments

I don't disagree with anything you say here, or quote here, Michael (and thanks, incidentally, for the nice things you said over on Roger Simon's blog; now if only Roger would blogroll me), but so far I've not been finding Zeyed's blog of any more interest than I would an Iraqi blog that had nothing but hateful things to say about America.

Zeyed, instead, has nothing but loving things to say. His blog might as well be written by a National Review regular, and I find his nonstop cheering of America as boring and unedifying as I find Indymedia hate screeds. If writing and point of view are one hundred percent predictable, where's the interest, where's the value?

I'm very possibly, of course, being too harsh and too quick here. I'll continue to look in on Zeyed for a while yet, to see if he develops nuance, or at all, or not.

Incidentally, if I might make a technical note: I'm back on a dial-up connection at present, and am unlikely to be your only such regular reader. Unfortunately, due to the profusion of photos on your front page, it literally takes about twenty minutes for your page to fully load, and to comment, one has to wait all that time, or the comment function doesn't, er, function. Might you consider shunting some pictures to a side-page with links on your front page instead?

Posted by: Gary Farber at October 29, 2003 12:58 AM

"WreCking destruction" might fit, but I have a sneaky idea that you meant to type "wreAking destruction."

Sorry to be so picky; I entirely concur with your sentiments, analysis and conclusions.

Posted by: Salamantis at October 29, 2003 01:55 AM

Salamantis,

Fixed the error. Thanks for that.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at October 29, 2003 02:06 AM

Exactly!

Posted by: sblafren at October 29, 2003 02:42 AM

Gary has it occurd to you that Zeyed's attitude might be the only sane one under the circumstances? If the Americans get dispirited and leave, his country is going to disintergrate into horrific sectarian violence until another fascist or theocratic strongman emerges. To YOU it's all just academic, your house won't be burned down in riots, or your family murdered.

You expect him to be bitching about nuance? What is he, a goddamn reporter? It's his LIFE on the line. The American forces are all that's between educated, secular young Iraqis like Zeyed and an Islamic or Baathist hell, between having a future and not.

Think about it, I think your casual dismissal of his fervent hopes that he isn't thrown to the wolves is profoundly patronising and contemptible.

(That's assuming that Zeyeds blog is legit of course, and the jury is still out.)

Posted by: Amos at October 29, 2003 03:04 AM

Check Zeyed today -- great post about how & why he blogs.

Posted by: Tom Grey at October 29, 2003 06:25 AM

Why would anyone expect religious fanatics to be rational people? Of course they are dumb, they are the reason why the Middle East is such a backward place despite the fact they are sitting on the most sought after natural resource in the world. The terrorists have unconditional supporters in the West not because they share the same beliefs, but because my enemy's enemy is my friend. If Hilary were in office doing the exact same thing as Bush, she'd be praised for exactly the same things Bush is being criticised on by liberals and leftists. Some may think liberals are naive, but I believe they are dishonest.

Posted by: JJ Walker at October 29, 2003 07:00 AM

When I see repeated press reports and other evidence that Iraqi civilians are angry at the terrorists, rather than Americans, I'll believe that these terrorists are "dumb."

Posted by: Markus Rose at October 29, 2003 07:41 AM

The shrill Diana's would have us abandon the Iraqi people to these vermin because we haven't kept up with our Michel Aflaq.

Posted by: David at October 29, 2003 07:47 AM

I thought Zeyad's most recent post addressed most of the questions about his legitimacy. He has a reasonable take on his own blog, acknowledging that he is only one person and not a journalist, and encouraging readers to seek out other Iraqi blogs in addition to his own. There's always a chance that he's not legit, but if so I think his cover will be exposed rather quick. And there will always those who consider him illegitimate solely because they disagree with him - in the comments section of his last post someone accuses him of working for Chalabi. Of course now that Totten's gotten linked over at National Review some will say the same about him.

Posted by: Peter G. at October 29, 2003 07:50 AM

Couldn't agree more with the 'thug' descriptor. Back when Islamic fundamentalist terrorism first became an issue, I started to read about the religion and why it was so hostile to concepts like democracy. One theory was that Christianity had a 2000 year history of battling with state persecution and therefore learned how to establish itself as an independent set of institutions a long time ago - Render unto Caesar, that which Caesars and render unto God, that which is Gods. The Islamic religion has no such history and it will indeed be very challenging to integrate such a religion within any form of democratic governance.

All well and good - except my thinking has gone 180 degrees. I no longer grant these terrorists the dignity of possessing a complex or spiritually driven rationale for their activities. Don't tax my patience. They are nothing more than thugs hiding in a cave in the desert with their camels and their peevish hatred - no different than Ted Koszinski hiding in his little hut in the mountains with his dog and his 'manifesto.'

I wish the people in this country with input to post-war management issues would start to use psychological techniques that are as sophisticated as the war hardware. Stir the Iraqi people into revolt against these shameless thugs by stripping them of their protective coat of religion twisted into ideological politics and, I dare say, all done with the emotional maturity of a 6-year old on the playground of hell.

Posted by: Lynne at October 29, 2003 07:50 AM

I'm very possibly, of course, being too harsh and too quick here. I'll continue to look in on Zeyed for a while yet, to see if he develops nuance, or at all, or not.

That's because Zeyed isn't a member of the debating society, as we all are. He and his people are in a fight for their lives, hardly an incentive to develop "nuance." If you wan't nuance, stick to the academics who don't have a stake in the matter.

I think it's good to hear an Iraqi voice sometimes, to see the unfolding events through their eyes, instead of the same filtered and nuanced spin from NPR, BBC, and CNN.

Posted by: David at October 29, 2003 07:57 AM

When I see repeated press reports and other evidence that Iraqi civilians are angry at the terrorists, rather than Americans, I'll believe that these terrorists are "dumb."

I agree with you wholeheartedly. Terror works.

Posted by: David at October 29, 2003 07:58 AM

The title seems to suggest Iraqis/Muslims are part of or should be part of the snake.

Posted by: JJ Walker at October 29, 2003 08:48 AM

well said, michael. It grows so tiring never hearing the positive news in this whole messed up situation.

Sure, Bush has bungled some of this. But I know it was the Right Thing To Do and, this issue, more so than September 11th, has changed my "political compass" dramatically.

I'm no longer concerned with left or right. I just try to put things through a moral filter and think of them in terms of "right" and "wrong."

Posted by: scotty the body at October 29, 2003 09:41 AM

When I see repeated press reports and other
evidence that Iraqi civilians are angry at
the terrorists, rather than Americans, I'll
believe that these terrorists are "dumb."

Markus:

That's just it. You won't see the "repeated press reports" that you mention. That's because the reporters have a dog in this fight.

First, they were wrong about whether the coalition would rapidly win the hot war with minimal casualties or not.

Then they were wrong about how the coalition's victory would be received by the Iraqi people in the immediate aftermath of the hot war.

Now, they are on the precipice of being wrong about how the Iraqis will enjoy their emerging liberty, and prosper within it.

The thought of being wrong so often in such rapid succession is painful. Therefore, you won't see them talking to the Iraqi constituency that Zayed represents.

---Tom Nally, New Orleans

Posted by: Tom Nally at October 29, 2003 09:49 AM

Zeyads blog, and the other blogs from Iraq that he links to, are fantastic and interesting. Restores my hope and belief that despite all that we are doing wrong in Iraq and the Middle East -- Rumsfeld's assinine decision to deploy too few troops, Bush's incompetence in getting other nations to join us, our ignorance of their culture, religion and language, our unwillingness to constrain the arrogant pricks running Israel these days -- we are still basically the good guys, and basically on the side of progress, in Iraq especially, and for the most part, in the rest of the Middle East as well. It might take awhile, eventually I hope most Iraqis will learn to recognize this.

Tom, I heard too much pro-USA cheerleading from the embedded reporters in April and May (and not just on Fox) to buy your judgement of the press...it sounds like another specious charge of "liberal bias." I don't read Zayed saying things are hunky dory over there, either.

Posted by: Markus Rose at October 29, 2003 12:01 PM

Tom,

Love the "dog in this fight" comment. I will steal it repeatedly. Inspiring.

Posted by: Patrick Lasswell at October 29, 2003 12:19 PM

Marcus,
This thread is dedicated to Zayed blog - try to stay on the topic. Israel elected her leaders to defend their people - your opinion is arrogantly pricky even more.

Posted by: marek at October 29, 2003 12:38 PM

Israel elected her leaders to defend their people.

If the haters don't like Sharon and Likud, blame the palestinians. They elected him.

Posted by: David at October 29, 2003 01:26 PM

Marek -- sorry, I'm new to blogs and I didn't know that each thread needis supposed to be that tightly focused...my swipe at Israel was parenthetical and appropriately contextualized, but of course any specific response to it takes thus off on a tangent. Perhaps I should have waited for a more appropriate time to lecture my newly adopted neocon brethren on the moral bankruptcy of the Likud Party and its supporters.

Posted by: Markus Rose at October 29, 2003 01:40 PM

Marcus,
I beg to differ. Who runs Israel is irrelevant to what US does in Iraq and what an Iraqi blogger thinks of it. The idea to wait for the right time sounds fine. And can I be de-adopted, please?

Posted by: marek at October 29, 2003 01:53 PM

Amos: I didn't "dismiss" Zeyed's "fervent hopes." I, in fact, said not a word about his hopes.

I said I had yet to find his blog terribly interesting. How one gets from that to the other would seem to require a bit of fever, and possibly less than sterling reading comprehension.

Were I in his place, my views would undoubtedly be extremely similar to his.

Say, what do you know? I'm in my place, and my views are extremely similar to his.

That's why I've found him less interesting, so far, than other Iraqi bloggers. I don't need someone else to repeat my own views to me.

You are welcome to have a different subjective set of interests than I do. Attempting to tell me that my own are objectively wrong fails the test of logical rhetoric.

JJ Walker: "liberals are dishonest." Yes, another useful, never-before-heard, contribution to calm and helpful political analysis. It takes us very far down the road of accomplishing true understanding of what proper policy should be.

The more generalizations, name-calling, and pie-throwing, the better we shall be!

I do, by the way, find Iraqi blogs extremely interesting. I find Riverbend and Salem Pax extremely interesting because they present views from a different viewpoint than I am familiar with. When Zeyed does so, he's also interesting. When he's merely saying the same things I could read in a thousand American or British or wherever blogs, or happen to already think, I find him less interesting.

I am not, of course, calling upon him to modify his opinions one iota to make himself "more interesting" to me. That would be condescending and patronizing. He's entitled to his opinions and viewpoints and reactions, and I respect that. I'm also, you know, entitled to mine. The corallary is left as an exercise for the reader.

Posted by: Gary Farber at October 29, 2003 02:10 PM

I like the "dog in this fight" comment, as well -- it does a good job of describing the Bush Administration's discussion of Iraq too, no?

Posted by: Kimmitt at October 30, 2003 08:00 AM

I like the "dog in this fight" comment,
as well -- it does a good job of
describing the Bush Administration's
discussion of Iraq too, no?

Uh, yeaaauhh...I hope to God that they
have a "dog in this fight"!

The difference between the reporting regime
and the Bush cabinet is that Bush and his cabinet
don't pose as being non-biased or non-ideological!
Just the opposite, in my view. They're definitely
biased toward eventual consenual government
for the Iraqi people. They're definitely biased toward
the de-Baathification of Iraq. They're
definitely biased toward the defeat of Islamo-
fascism in Iraq.

So, yes, they do have a dog in this fight!
And if they didn't, they shouldn't be occupying
the Executive branch of government of the United
States, and shouldering the mantle of leadership
of the free world.

---Tom Nally, New Orleans

Posted by: Tom Nally at October 30, 2003 08:56 AM

I like the "dog in this fight" comment, as well -- it does a good job of describing the Bush Administration's discussion of Iraq too, no?

Yes, that is true. We all have a dog in this fight. And we all should hope we win and Iraq becomes free, stable, and prosperous.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at October 30, 2003 09:14 AM

The issue is not whether one has a dog in the fight, but rather whether that dog is in fact a rottwieler or a poodle, or for that matter a wolf in sheep's clothing.

In other words, it comes down to whether one is being honest about the reasons for one's position and statements.

Posted by: triticale at October 30, 2003 11:16 AM

I'm a little confused by the post.

"It is no way to win a popularity contest." Certainly, they are not trying to win a popularity contest within Iraq. These are methods of intimidation. They don't care about "support" (they'll take care of that with their own ilk), they just want to shut people up through coercive, threatening methods -- which ARE effective.

If you mean it is no way to win a popularity contest outside Iraq -- well, I'm not so sure that is true. They will be very popular with those who use the same tactics. They may be very effective in swaying public opinion against the war/reconstruction.

Posted by: cj at October 30, 2003 09:04 PM

cj: Certainly, they are not trying to win a popularity contest within Iraq.

True enough. But terrorists are not my blog audience. There are some people in this country who think the "resistance" is popular. They are who I had in mind when I wrote that.

Posted by: Michael J. Totten at October 30, 2003 09:28 PM

The resistance is not one group. I have no doubt that in many towns, especially in the Sunni Triangel area, fighting and killing Americans is very popular. If it wasn't, attacks would be diminishing, not increasing.

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