May 31, 2010
Middle Eastern Nukes and the Flotilla Fiasco
The United Nations passed a resolution on Friday demanding a nuclear-free Middle East and singling out Israel as the intransigent party instead of Iran. The Obama administration supports the decision, which makes about as much sense as disarming the Iraqi police right now in the name of a violence-free Baghdad.
Meanwhile, Israeli troops boarded a blockade running ship headed for Gaza armed with paint guns (yes, really) and were attacked at once by assailants wielding clubs and knives. Several people were killed and more were injured. Weapons caches were found on the boat, and some of wounded treated in Jerusalem were apparently wearing camouflage.
"We landed barehanded," an Israeli soldier said, "and they lynched us." You can choose not to believe that, I suppose.
The "international community" blames Israel, of course, for the deaths and injuries on board that boat, just as it singles out Israel instead of Iran on nuclear weapons and blames Israel for the Gaza war last year that Hamas started.
None of this is surprising, exactly. Self-defense has been all but criminalized in progressive countries like Britain, and Israel's right to exist, let alone defend itself, is recognized almost nowhere in the Middle East.
I don't know where all this is headed, exactly, but I'm pretty sure neither pacifist Europeans nor violently anti-Zionist Middle Easterners will be as happy with the outcome as they expect.
Posted by Michael J. Totten at May 31, 2010 12:35 PM
Comments
Great post!
The world has gone mad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYjkLUcbJWo&feature=player_embedded#!
On that video, you can clearly see that the "peace" protesters are the aggressors. I fear it won't matter much. To much of the world, Israel can do no right. (I remember in the 2006 Hezbollah war, many on the "left" (I use quotations b/c I don't consider them true leftists) stated that Israel started it).
I just hope news channels, etc., show the real footage, and give airtime to the crap they'll find on board. This wasn't a peace mission, but a PR stunt (and how much did Turkey's PM Edrogan have, if anything, to do with this?). I'm trying to convince my sensible friends who are outraged at Israel now (they are sensible, so they can be persuaded, or at least assuaged, by the facts as they come out). I'm already seeing, though, swastikas on Israeli flags on facebook, though. and "Likes" being added to comments like, "the only good Jew is a good soap. Me(ng)rkel (e), finish your job!"
BTW, Michael, any idea on when the West realizes that Edrogan's Turkey might be exposed for what it is: a crypto-Islamist state seeking to spread political Islam?
(and as a side note, maybe if the new, aggressive, Islamist Turkey is defanged and taken down to size a bit, we can finally have recognition of the Armenian Holocaust AND the establishment of a Kurdish state).
Posted by: Kyle at May 31, 2010 12:47 pm
The world has gone mad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYjkLUcbJWo&feature=player_embedded#!
On that video, you can clearly see that the "peace" protesters are the aggressors. I fear it won't matter much. To much of the world, Israel can do no right. (I remember in the 2006 Hezbollah war, many on the "left" (I use quotations b/c I don't consider them true leftists) stated that Israel started it).
I just hope news channels, etc., show the real footage, and give airtime to the crap they'll find on board. This wasn't a peace mission, but a PR stunt (and how much did Turkey's PM Edrogan have, if anything, to do with this?). I'm trying to convince my sensible friends who are outraged at Israel now (they are sensible, so they can be persuaded, or at least assuaged, by the facts as they come out). I'm already seeing, though, swastikas on Israeli flags on facebook, though. and "Likes" being added to comments like, "the only good Jew is a good soap. Me(ng)rkel (e), finish your job!"
BTW, Michael, any idea on when the West realizes that Edrogan's Turkey might be exposed for what it is: a crypto-Islamist state seeking to spread political Islam?
(and as a side note, maybe if the new, aggressive, Islamist Turkey is defanged and taken down to size a bit, we can finally have recognition of the Armenian Holocaust AND the establishment of a Kurdish state).
That was an interesting video, Kyle
The worst thing about this incident is Turkey's hypocrisy. They criticize Israel for every move they make in Gaza -- as if Israel doesn't have a right to defend itself against its enemies, like Hamas -- while they do as they please in Kurdistan, bombing dozens of targets, including villages. Its ironic that as Erdogen begins to huff, puff, and cry about this incident a Turkish Naval Base comes under a rocket attack...will the international community condemn Turkey when the military responds by bombing Kurdistan? I won't hold my breath, will any of you?
"Rocket attack kills 6 in Southeast Turkey"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/10195996.stm
Should an aid convoy be prepared to help the Kurds? I wonder how the Turks would react...
And another thing...Turkey's lack of concern for what is happening in Iran is disturbing. Apparently, for Erdogen and his supporters, the slaughter of innocent Muslims is okay if the killers are Muslim, as in the case of the Basiji goons in Tehran.
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 12:59 pm
The worst thing about this incident is Turkey's hypocrisy. They criticize Israel for every move they make in Gaza -- as if Israel doesn't have a right to defend itself against its enemies, like Hamas -- while they do as they please in Kurdistan, bombing dozens of targets, including villages. Its ironic that as Erdogen begins to huff, puff, and cry about this incident a Turkish Naval Base comes under a rocket attack...will the international community condemn Turkey when the military responds by bombing Kurdistan? I won't hold my breath, will any of you?
"Rocket attack kills 6 in Southeast Turkey"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/10195996.stm
Should an aid convoy be prepared to help the Kurds? I wonder how the Turks would react...
And another thing...Turkey's lack of concern for what is happening in Iran is disturbing. Apparently, for Erdogen and his supporters, the slaughter of innocent Muslims is okay if the killers are Muslim, as in the case of the Basiji goons in Tehran.
I agree, great post. I am horrified by the reaction though. The world has truly gone mad. I think Turkey has been provoking Israel in different ways to have pretexts to cut off ties. As far as I'm concerned - good riddance. Maybe then they (Israel) will finally recognize the Armenian genocide - it's about friggin' time they did so.
Posted by: Irene at May 31, 2010 1:03 pm
"I'm pretty sure neither pacifist Europeans nor violently anti-Zionist Middle Easterners will be as happy with the outcome as they expect." Michael, can you elaborate?
Posted by: Harold at May 31, 2010 1:24 pm
Are you really trying to argue this was self-defense?
They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters. Did this flotilla also represent some existential threat to the jewish nation?
As for the NPT resolution, they singled out Israel instead of Iran since Iran has already signed the treat and unlike Israel has inspectors at its nuclear site.
Posted by: tg at May 31, 2010 1:26 pm
They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters. Did this flotilla also represent some existential threat to the jewish nation?
As for the NPT resolution, they singled out Israel instead of Iran since Iran has already signed the treat and unlike Israel has inspectors at its nuclear site.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/10197770.stm
Other protests have taken place
in Bristol and Manchester, where campaigners targeted the BBC building, smashing doors and placing a Palestinian flag on the roof.
That's what I'm talking about! :D
Posted by: Craig at May 31, 2010 1:28 pm
Other protests have taken place
in Bristol and Manchester, where campaigners targeted the BBC building, smashing doors and placing a Palestinian flag on the roof.
That's what I'm talking about! :D
TG,
Just out of curiosity, what do you think the humanitarian lion, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, would do if pro-Kurdish activists tried to sail into a Mediterranean port?
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 1:30 pm
Just out of curiosity, what do you think the humanitarian lion, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, would do if pro-Kurdish activists tried to sail into a Mediterranean port?
Craig,
I have seen pro-Gaza "peace activists" in action...its scary stuff. Back during the January '09 war there were masked men running around in San Francisco, waving Hamas flags and attacking a small rally that gathered to support Israel.
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 1:32 pm
I have seen pro-Gaza "peace activists" in action...its scary stuff. Back during the January '09 war there were masked men running around in San Francisco, waving Hamas flags and attacking a small rally that gathered to support Israel.
Are you really trying to argue this was self-defense?
I am, yeah. When gangs of "passengers" start mobbing military forces and disarming them, that's when they get killed.
They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters.
That was trying to run a naval blockade, which is an act of war.
Did this flotilla also represent some existential threat to the jewish nation?
Obviously, it did. Why do you think Turkey sponsored it? Why did YOU support it? Because Turkey wants to destroy the Israeli state, and so do you.
As for the NPT resolution, they singled out Israel instead of Iran since Iran has already signed the treat and unlike Israel has inspectors at its nuclear site.
No, they singled out Israel because they hate Israel. As do you.
Posted by: Craig at May 31, 2010 1:38 pm
I am, yeah. When gangs of "passengers" start mobbing military forces and disarming them, that's when they get killed.
They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters.
That was trying to run a naval blockade, which is an act of war.
Did this flotilla also represent some existential threat to the jewish nation?
Obviously, it did. Why do you think Turkey sponsored it? Why did YOU support it? Because Turkey wants to destroy the Israeli state, and so do you.
As for the NPT resolution, they singled out Israel instead of Iran since Iran has already signed the treat and unlike Israel has inspectors at its nuclear site.
No, they singled out Israel because they hate Israel. As do you.
tg said,
"They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters. "
...and knives, and clubs, and stun grenades, and building materials for rockets, and so on, and so on.
I wonder what else will be found on board in the days ahead!
Posted by: Kyle at May 31, 2010 1:39 pm
"They boarded a ship carrying medicine/food/toys in international waters. "
...and knives, and clubs, and stun grenades, and building materials for rockets, and so on, and so on.
I wonder what else will be found on board in the days ahead!
I wonder what else will be found on board in the days ahead!
I'm wondering if any footage will be found in the possession of those "journalists" who were on board those ships that was deliberately with-held? That would be sloppy work on the part of any self-respecting propagandist, but one can always hope.
Posted by: Craig at May 31, 2010 1:45 pm
I'm wondering if any footage will be found in the possession of those "journalists" who were on board those ships that was deliberately with-held? That would be sloppy work on the part of any self-respecting propagandist, but one can always hope.
TG: Are you really trying to argue this was self-defense?
Israeli soldier: We landed barehanded and they lynched us.
Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 31, 2010 1:50 pm
Israeli soldier: We landed barehanded and they lynched us.
TG,
If you stab a police officer who pulls you over for what you think is no good reason at all and he shoots you, is it self-defense or something else?
Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 31, 2010 1:51 pm
If you stab a police officer who pulls you over for what you think is no good reason at all and he shoots you, is it self-defense or something else?
"Israeli soldier: We landed barehanded and they lynched us"
The commander of this poor soldier should be court-marshaled for sure. Boarding a ship in international waters is dangerous. And in this case the commander is grossly negligent in his duty. Clearly poor planning on his part.
Posted by: Bob at May 31, 2010 2:06 pm
The commander of this poor soldier should be court-marshaled for sure. Boarding a ship in international waters is dangerous. And in this case the commander is grossly negligent in his duty. Clearly poor planning on his part.
Craig, please go easy on TG. :-)
TG please view these two videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bU12KW-XyZE&feature=player_embedded&has_verified=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYjkLUcbJWo&feature=player_embedded#!
I would appreciate your perspectives on them. If you care about the Palestinians, it does you credit.
"in Bristol and Manchester, where campaigners targeted the BBC building, smashing doors and placing a Palestinian flag on the roof." What morons. The Palestinians don't need "friends" like these.
"Recep Tayyip Erdogan, would do if pro-Kurdish activists tried to sail into a Mediterranean port?" Please clarify the question. Turkey has the right to do what it wants to ships that dock at Turkish ports.
"Back during the January '09 war there were masked men running around in San Francisco, waving Hamas flags and attacking a small rally that gathered to support Israel." Didn't know. Sad.
"Because Turkey wants to destroy the Israeli state, and so do you." There is no evidence that TG wants to destroy Israel.
Turkey has been one of Israel's closest and most important allies since 1948. Turkey and Israel still cooperate very closely on defense research, fighting terrorism, cross training, international covert operations, and many other issues. I think Turkey still sees Israel as a valuable chip to play against the Arabs, Iranians, Europeans, Americans, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans. [Turkey also has very close defense ties with South Korea.]
Posted by: anan at May 31, 2010 2:15 pm
TG please view these two videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bU12KW-XyZE&feature=player_embedded&has_verified=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYjkLUcbJWo&feature=player_embedded#!
I would appreciate your perspectives on them. If you care about the Palestinians, it does you credit.
"in Bristol and Manchester, where campaigners targeted the BBC building, smashing doors and placing a Palestinian flag on the roof." What morons. The Palestinians don't need "friends" like these.
"Recep Tayyip Erdogan, would do if pro-Kurdish activists tried to sail into a Mediterranean port?" Please clarify the question. Turkey has the right to do what it wants to ships that dock at Turkish ports.
"Back during the January '09 war there were masked men running around in San Francisco, waving Hamas flags and attacking a small rally that gathered to support Israel." Didn't know. Sad.
"Because Turkey wants to destroy the Israeli state, and so do you." There is no evidence that TG wants to destroy Israel.
Turkey has been one of Israel's closest and most important allies since 1948. Turkey and Israel still cooperate very closely on defense research, fighting terrorism, cross training, international covert operations, and many other issues. I think Turkey still sees Israel as a valuable chip to play against the Arabs, Iranians, Europeans, Americans, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans. [Turkey also has very close defense ties with South Korea.]
"... in international waters"
Didn't Iran seize several British sailors a few years back in what was not only NOT international waters but was Iraqi (read: NOT Iranian) waters?
Why do I get the sense that many people screaming "international waters!" today are the same people who were *convinced* Iran acted correctly when they kidnapped the Brits in Iraqi waters? (even believing the Iranian lie that they strayed into Iranian waters?).
There could have been a nuclear weapon on board and the apologists would haul out the same anti-Israel stuff.
As these events happen, I begin to see that details are irrelevant. For the anti-Israel (mostly) left, any action taken against Israel is justified, and any defense mounted by Israel is inexcusable.
Posted by: Kyle at May 31, 2010 2:29 pm
Didn't Iran seize several British sailors a few years back in what was not only NOT international waters but was Iraqi (read: NOT Iranian) waters?
Why do I get the sense that many people screaming "international waters!" today are the same people who were *convinced* Iran acted correctly when they kidnapped the Brits in Iraqi waters? (even believing the Iranian lie that they strayed into Iranian waters?).
There could have been a nuclear weapon on board and the apologists would haul out the same anti-Israel stuff.
As these events happen, I begin to see that details are irrelevant. For the anti-Israel (mostly) left, any action taken against Israel is justified, and any defense mounted by Israel is inexcusable.
anan: Turkey has been one of Israel's closest and most important allies since 1948. Turkey and Israel still cooperate very closely on defense research, fighting terrorism....
Catch a clue: Turkey supports this Hamas-enabling publicity stunt, and is cozying up to Iran - the largest single supporter of terrorism in the world.
Turkey stinks and is getting ranker by the day. Their hypocrisy is astounding.
Posted by: Li'l Mamzer at May 31, 2010 2:50 pm
Catch a clue: Turkey supports this Hamas-enabling publicity stunt, and is cozying up to Iran - the largest single supporter of terrorism in the world.
Turkey stinks and is getting ranker by the day. Their hypocrisy is astounding.
"Why do I get the sense that many people screaming "international waters!" today are the same people who were *convinced* Iran acted correctly when they kidnapped the Brits in Iraqi waters?"
Well said...
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 2:51 pm
Well said...
"Please clarify the question. Turkey has the right to do what it wants to ships that dock at Turkish ports."
Every country should have that right. So why is Israel treated differently?
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 2:53 pm
Every country should have that right. So why is Israel treated differently?
Wait a sec...it looks like Turkey has some competition in this hypocritical, international tantrum.
"Pakistan condemns Israeli raid on flotilla"
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/world/16-pakistan+condemns+israeli+attack+on+humanitarian+mission-hs-03
What's next? Is Sri Lanka going to join the condemnation?
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 2:57 pm
"Pakistan condemns Israeli raid on flotilla"
http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/world/16-pakistan+condemns+israeli+attack+on+humanitarian+mission-hs-03
What's next? Is Sri Lanka going to join the condemnation?
Honest people don't use terms like "unarmed" or "armed with paint guns" to describe the IDF when the truth also included firearms. All the blood libel is against those helpless victims in the IDF, and yet all the dead people are on the side of the Pro-Palestinian actions. Your recent work has really sucked, Mike.
Everyone's competing to be the victim, behavior you claim to hate but are happy to enable for your own team. Smells like hypocrisy.
Posted by: glasnost at May 31, 2010 4:32 pm
Everyone's competing to be the victim, behavior you claim to hate but are happy to enable for your own team. Smells like hypocrisy.
Turkey has been one of Israel's closest and most important allies since 1948.
Obviously, not any more anand :)
It's time for the US to review its relationship with Turkey as well.
Posted by: Craig at May 31, 2010 4:35 pm
Obviously, not any more anand :)
It's time for the US to review its relationship with Turkey as well.
Glasnost: Everyone's competing to be the victim
I'm not saying the Israelis are victims.
If you stab a policeman or a soldier, you should expect to be shot. This is hard for you to understand?
Posted by: Michael J. Totten at May 31, 2010 4:55 pm
I'm not saying the Israelis are victims.
If you stab a policeman or a soldier, you should expect to be shot. This is hard for you to understand?
"Smells like hypocrisy."
Did Erdogan's plane touch down in NYC for the UN meeting already? That was fast.
Posted by: C.H. at May 31, 2010 4:57 pm
Did Erdogan's plane touch down in NYC for the UN meeting already? That was fast.
Craig - "It's time for the US to review its relationship with Turkey as well."
Don't hold your breath. Turkey is an important regional player and it's rapidly becoming Islamist. BHO seems more inclined to offer Israel as a sacrificial lamb to appease Islamists than stand up to them.
I hope I'm wrong...
Posted by: Abu Sa'ar at May 31, 2010 5:21 pm
Don't hold your breath. Turkey is an important regional player and it's rapidly becoming Islamist. BHO seems more inclined to offer Israel as a sacrificial lamb to appease Islamists than stand up to them.
I hope I'm wrong...
Definition of the term "International Waters."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_waters
===
If they were "peaceful" they would not have been armed and they certainly would not have attacked the IDF.
I don't even have to look to know that there is nothing "peaceful" on those boats that the Israeli government doesn't already ship into Gaza by the tens of thousands of tons.
http://www.google.com/images?q=gaza%20market&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi
That doesn't look anything at all like a death or concentration camp and doesn't look anything at all like the Warsaw Ghetto, now does it?
Why ship concrete into a statelet that is comprised mostly of sand and has a long coastline? Water and sand being the two primary ingredients of concrete.
If they were "peaceful" then there was no reason to not submit their ships to an Israeli inspection. If they were "peaceful" then their goods could have crossed the Egyptian border, after an Egyptian inspection.
===
TG and Glasnost are Jew haters, their comments in this thread alone confirm that beyond any shadow of a doubt.
Anan - Do you have a learning disability or some other brain damage that you can use as an excuse for the otherworldly pablum that you commit to the Web?
DEAR
WORLD,
R
Posted by: Render at May 31, 2010 5:37 pm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_waters
===
If they were "peaceful" they would not have been armed and they certainly would not have attacked the IDF.
I don't even have to look to know that there is nothing "peaceful" on those boats that the Israeli government doesn't already ship into Gaza by the tens of thousands of tons.
http://www.google.com/images?q=gaza%20market&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi
That doesn't look anything at all like a death or concentration camp and doesn't look anything at all like the Warsaw Ghetto, now does it?
Why ship concrete into a statelet that is comprised mostly of sand and has a long coastline? Water and sand being the two primary ingredients of concrete.
If they were "peaceful" then there was no reason to not submit their ships to an Israeli inspection. If they were "peaceful" then their goods could have crossed the Egyptian border, after an Egyptian inspection.
===
TG and Glasnost are Jew haters, their comments in this thread alone confirm that beyond any shadow of a doubt.
Anan - Do you have a learning disability or some other brain damage that you can use as an excuse for the otherworldly pablum that you commit to the Web?
DEAR
WORLD,
R
Abu Sa'ar,
Don't hold your breath. Turkey is an important regional player and it's rapidly becoming Islamist.
Turkey seems to be forgetting what region it's actually *in*. But that's for the Europeans to deal with. A larger problem for Americans is that Turkey seems to be forgetting what military alliances its actually *in* :o
BHO seems more inclined to offer Israel as a sacrificial lamb to appease Islamists than stand up to them.
Maybe so, but one can always hope. Examine this article from CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/05/31/israel.gaza.raid.reaction/index.html
White House Spokesman Bill Burton said the United States "deeply regrets the loss of life and injuries sustained and is currently working to understand the circumstances surrounding this tragedy."
That did not impress Namik Tan, the Turkish ambassador to the United States, who called the U.S. response "sort of weak."
Tan called the attack "unacceptable" and an "act of piracy" and said he "expects a strong reaction from the United States."
I'm in agreement that there should be a strong reaction from the United States. I think we should start be ejecting Mr Namik Tan, the Turkish Ambassador to the United States.
I hope I'm wrong...
I hope you're wrong too, but if not the really great thing about American politics is that Presidents don't serve for life :)
Posted by: Craig at May 31, 2010 6:05 pm
Don't hold your breath. Turkey is an important regional player and it's rapidly becoming Islamist.
Turkey seems to be forgetting what region it's actually *in*. But that's for the Europeans to deal with. A larger problem for Americans is that Turkey seems to be forgetting what military alliances its actually *in* :o
BHO seems more inclined to offer Israel as a sacrificial lamb to appease Islamists than stand up to them.
Maybe so, but one can always hope. Examine this article from CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/05/31/israel.gaza.raid.reaction/index.html
White House Spokesman Bill Burton said the United States "deeply regrets the loss of life and injuries sustained and is currently working to understand the circumstances surrounding this tragedy."
That did not impress Namik Tan, the Turkish ambassador to the United States, who called the U.S. response "sort of weak."
Tan called the attack "unacceptable" and an "act of piracy" and said he "expects a strong reaction from the United States."
I'm in agreement that there should be a strong reaction from the United States. I think we should start be ejecting Mr Namik Tan, the Turkish Ambassador to the United States.
I hope I'm wrong...
I hope you're wrong too, but if not the really great thing about American politics is that Presidents don't serve for life :)
Craig, I agree with your sentiment. I am pretty depressed that Israel did not see this coming. I mean, they could have done all sorts of things to disable the ships. Their border guards seem to have a greater understanding of how to deal with criminal activists which these people clearly are.
Obama has at this moment about as much chance of getting this Democratically leaning voter voting for him as.....
Posted by: Maxtrue at May 31, 2010 7:16 pm
Obama has at this moment about as much chance of getting this Democratically leaning voter voting for him as.....
The 'international community' makes me ... has made me want for a long time ... to quote a great British philosopher:
'Well, they would say that, wouldn't they?'
Posted by: greeneyeshade at May 31, 2010 8:30 pm
'Well, they would say that, wouldn't they?'
In glasnost's world, the only proper self-defense posture for Jews is bending over and grabbing their ankles.
Posted by: Gary Rosen at May 31, 2010 10:13 pm
"all the dead people are on the side of the Pro-Palestinian actions"
It's not the fault of Jews if our enemies are dysfunctional savages with no respect for human life, including their own. Like I say, Jews have survived for 4000 years not because we're so great but because somehow antisemites always turn out to be nitwits, misfucks and born losers. By the way, I guess the USA must have been the bad guy in WWII since we lost hardly any civilians compared to the Germans and Japanese.
Posted by: Gary Rosen at May 31, 2010 10:17 pm
It's not the fault of Jews if our enemies are dysfunctional savages with no respect for human life, including their own. Like I say, Jews have survived for 4000 years not because we're so great but because somehow antisemites always turn out to be nitwits, misfucks and born losers. By the way, I guess the USA must have been the bad guy in WWII since we lost hardly any civilians compared to the Germans and Japanese.
Glasnost might be dead wrong on Taiwan, but sometimes he makes perceptive observations.
"the only proper self-defense posture for Jews is bending over and grabbing their ankles." How did Glasnost imply this?
"our enemies are dysfunctional savages with no respect for human life, including their own." Who exactly are dysfunctional savages?
Who do you regard as the enemies of the Jews?
Please try to remember that the enemies of the Jews are also the enemies of the world more generally. You have many allies if only you choose to notice them.
Posted by: anan at June 1, 2010 12:20 am
"the only proper self-defense posture for Jews is bending over and grabbing their ankles." How did Glasnost imply this?
"our enemies are dysfunctional savages with no respect for human life, including their own." Who exactly are dysfunctional savages?
Who do you regard as the enemies of the Jews?
Please try to remember that the enemies of the Jews are also the enemies of the world more generally. You have many allies if only you choose to notice them.
"nitwits, misfucks and born losers." Whoa. Tone it down a little bro. ;-)
Posted by: anan at June 1, 2010 12:21 am
Because criticizing Israel's action yesterday strengthens every thug in the Middle East, it is better to refrain. I cannot be on the same side as Ahmadinejad and neutrality is not an option.
Posted by: Joe at June 1, 2010 2:36 am
Apparently nobody asks himself why there were so many "activists" on board of those ships.
You don't need 600 of them to ship those goods into Gaza.
However, those big numbers come in handily when it's all about obtaining sufficiently big numbers of "martyrs", especially Turkish ones.
Whether those dead fools will help to lift Israel's and Egypt's blockade of Gaza remains doubtful.
Israel simply cannot permit itself that weapons could be shipped that easily into Gaza.
Whereas you can bet that their death will ensure that the already cornered Turkish generals will no longer be in a position to permit Israel to use its airspace for attacking Iran's nuclear facilities or the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. The Turkish public opinion will no longer be in a mood to accept this. It would be the generals' final defeat against Erdoğan, unless the generals would accept to risk a prolonged civil war as in Algeria.
And Obama will now be even less supportive for Israel striking unilaterally at Iran.
Israel should understand that it stands alone, at least for now, and that it is running out of time, and that it has fewer and fewer options at hand.
Game and set for Erdoğan and Teheran.
But not yet the match.
Erdoğan and Teheran could be laughing too quickly, because the growing impact of Iran on Syria, Turkey and Iraq creates an exceptional long term opportunity for their one and common enemy (victim would be more correct), namely the Kurds.
In order that this opportunity for the Kurds would materialize in the long run, their united enemies should be defeated. It might suffice that both Iran and Syria would be decisively defeated. Iraq could then tilt and Turkey would be cornered.
Israel has been on the defensive for too long.
Israel could start to stimulate similar "humanitarian PR" tactics against the Turkish-Iranian axis which is being created. Let the Kurds undertake similar mediatized "humanitarian" actions against the Turks, but do it more cleverly (no weapons, no camouflage outfits). The Palestinians and their allies wrote the format. Use it and ammeliorate it. Try to ensure that the plight of the Kurds starts getting similar media coverage like Gaza and the West Bank: as intense and equally one sided.
Do the same with other oppressed minorities, for instance the Alevi in Turkey.
Israel: start cornering your erstwhile ally, because he's lost to you anyway, and start setting up new allies which will remain loyal to you in the long term, even after that they have served your short and mid term goals.
This means that Israel should remain loyal to those new allies too, contrary to what America has done with the Kurds in some of the previous decades.
Some Arab countries shouldn't be that hostile against a united and independent Kurdistan, because it would weaken some of their major long term enemies.
Until now Israel's military objective was always to defeat its enemies' armies, not to destroy their countries. This amounts simply to buying some time, because those enemies simply don't go away.
Israel should start thinking about destroying its enemies, by creating opportunities whereby some of those countries are splitted up or splitted off. Weaken them structurally, but don't create new Frankensteins such as Hamas.
Posted by: Pierre Saelen at June 1, 2010 2:49 am
You don't need 600 of them to ship those goods into Gaza.
However, those big numbers come in handily when it's all about obtaining sufficiently big numbers of "martyrs", especially Turkish ones.
Whether those dead fools will help to lift Israel's and Egypt's blockade of Gaza remains doubtful.
Israel simply cannot permit itself that weapons could be shipped that easily into Gaza.
Whereas you can bet that their death will ensure that the already cornered Turkish generals will no longer be in a position to permit Israel to use its airspace for attacking Iran's nuclear facilities or the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. The Turkish public opinion will no longer be in a mood to accept this. It would be the generals' final defeat against Erdoğan, unless the generals would accept to risk a prolonged civil war as in Algeria.
And Obama will now be even less supportive for Israel striking unilaterally at Iran.
Israel should understand that it stands alone, at least for now, and that it is running out of time, and that it has fewer and fewer options at hand.
Game and set for Erdoğan and Teheran.
But not yet the match.
Erdoğan and Teheran could be laughing too quickly, because the growing impact of Iran on Syria, Turkey and Iraq creates an exceptional long term opportunity for their one and common enemy (victim would be more correct), namely the Kurds.
In order that this opportunity for the Kurds would materialize in the long run, their united enemies should be defeated. It might suffice that both Iran and Syria would be decisively defeated. Iraq could then tilt and Turkey would be cornered.
Israel has been on the defensive for too long.
Israel could start to stimulate similar "humanitarian PR" tactics against the Turkish-Iranian axis which is being created. Let the Kurds undertake similar mediatized "humanitarian" actions against the Turks, but do it more cleverly (no weapons, no camouflage outfits). The Palestinians and their allies wrote the format. Use it and ammeliorate it. Try to ensure that the plight of the Kurds starts getting similar media coverage like Gaza and the West Bank: as intense and equally one sided.
Do the same with other oppressed minorities, for instance the Alevi in Turkey.
Israel: start cornering your erstwhile ally, because he's lost to you anyway, and start setting up new allies which will remain loyal to you in the long term, even after that they have served your short and mid term goals.
This means that Israel should remain loyal to those new allies too, contrary to what America has done with the Kurds in some of the previous decades.
Some Arab countries shouldn't be that hostile against a united and independent Kurdistan, because it would weaken some of their major long term enemies.
Until now Israel's military objective was always to defeat its enemies' armies, not to destroy their countries. This amounts simply to buying some time, because those enemies simply don't go away.
Israel should start thinking about destroying its enemies, by creating opportunities whereby some of those countries are splitted up or splitted off. Weaken them structurally, but don't create new Frankensteins such as Hamas.
Anan - "Who exactly are dysfunctional savages?"
Israel's enemies: Hamas, Hizballah, the Fascist regime in Syria, Islamists of all stripes, the Iranian Ayatollahs' regime, the anti-Semitic barbarians in the Muslim world at large, the enablers of the above in the West. All but the last are savages and often dysfunctional; the latter are dysfunctional and sometimes savages.
Posted by: Abu Sa'ar at June 1, 2010 3:19 am
Israel's enemies: Hamas, Hizballah, the Fascist regime in Syria, Islamists of all stripes, the Iranian Ayatollahs' regime, the anti-Semitic barbarians in the Muslim world at large, the enablers of the above in the West. All but the last are savages and often dysfunctional; the latter are dysfunctional and sometimes savages.
Anan - "Who exactly are dysfunctional savages?"
Abu Sa'ar - "Israel's enemies: Hamas, Hizballah, the Fascist regime in Syria, Islamists of all stripes, the Iranian Ayatollahs' regime, the anti-Semitic barbarians in the Muslim world at large, the enablers of the above in the West. All but the last are savages and often dysfunctional; the latter are dysfunctional and sometimes savages."
Given the sympathies of the questioner, one should consider what he sees as Hezbollah's function, for example. I'm sure he sees no dysfunction there.
Posted by: Li'l Mamzer at June 1, 2010 8:22 am
Abu Sa'ar - "Israel's enemies: Hamas, Hizballah, the Fascist regime in Syria, Islamists of all stripes, the Iranian Ayatollahs' regime, the anti-Semitic barbarians in the Muslim world at large, the enablers of the above in the West. All but the last are savages and often dysfunctional; the latter are dysfunctional and sometimes savages."
Given the sympathies of the questioner, one should consider what he sees as Hezbollah's function, for example. I'm sure he sees no dysfunction there.
michael you surpassed yourself in defending a crime that EVERY person with a 1% intelligence knows that it is a CRIME.
You are either trying to belittle our intelligence using your hypocrisy, or you are reflecting and echoing the Murders unintelligently.
How on earth would an elite commando unit go on board a ship without real ammunition, would you go into a battle like this without live ammunition, who beleives these lies.
43 nations were on the board the flotillas,not only muslims, not only turks.
What is the name of the soldier, show us his face, let us investigate with him, let us ask him FACE to FACE what happened, or is it a "soldier from IDF" that we have to beleive what he says is true.
This time your hypocricy is BLATANT, EXPOSED, DEGRADING for you and for whoever beleives or propagate it.
Posted by: ABJ at June 2, 2010 11:24 am
You are either trying to belittle our intelligence using your hypocrisy, or you are reflecting and echoing the Murders unintelligently.
How on earth would an elite commando unit go on board a ship without real ammunition, would you go into a battle like this without live ammunition, who beleives these lies.
43 nations were on the board the flotillas,not only muslims, not only turks.
What is the name of the soldier, show us his face, let us investigate with him, let us ask him FACE to FACE what happened, or is it a "soldier from IDF" that we have to beleive what he says is true.
This time your hypocricy is BLATANT, EXPOSED, DEGRADING for you and for whoever beleives or propagate it.
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